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Philosophy no Dance’s Mariri Okutsu chatted with Billboard Japan for its Women in Music interview series featuring female players in the Japanese entertainment industry. The WIM initiative in Japan launched in 2022 to celebrate artists, producers and executives who have made significant contributions to music and inspired other women through their work.

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Okutsu made the transition from being a singer-songwriter to an idol group member nine years ago. On the podcast “B-side Talk – Are you taking care of your mental health?” she advocates the importance of mental well-being. Okutsu, who says she was able to find “what’s most important” after going through mental health problems, shares her thoughts on the value of being herself as an idol singer and in her private life.

Tell us how you became an idol group member.

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Before I became an idol performer, I was a singer-songwriter and also played in a band. I was asked if I’d be interested in doing idol work, and although it was a world I knew nothing about, you only live once so I figured I’d give it a try. I’d never even danced before, but took the plunge.

What was your personality like before you became an idol?

Before I became an idol, I think I was more particular about things. I liked rock music and thought I was badass when performing, so when people said stuff like, “You have a good figure” [mentioning the size of her breasts] and “You should sing cuter songs,” I resented that people didn’t see the things I wanted them to see. I was more heavily into the rock mentality back then than I am now, so when people said things like that, I turned up the volume on my guitar even more and distorted the sound, just to be rebellious. [Laughs] In terms of clothes, too, I want to wear my favorite gear for “battle” on stage, and to be the way I need to be in order to shine the most.

Did you ever feel bewildered by the idol scene, since it’s so different from your career up until then?

I’m now in my ninth year of being an idol performer, and feel that it’s a very warm world with passionate fans. At first, I searched for ways to live up to the expectations of what an “idol” should be like. I tried wearing big bows and frilly clothes, and even chose “cute” drinks and food. [Laughs] I tried really hard to figure out what my character should be like, but couldn’t keep trying to be someone I’m not. So I went, “Nope! Not gonna work!” and just showed who I really am, and things became so much easier. After I realized that it’s important to be myself, both in my idol career and in life itself, I try not to put on a front and make sure my true self is as lovely as it can be.

I think it takes courage to show your true self. What advice would you give to someone who can’t muster up the courage to do that?

Being able to create your own character by wearing “armor” is also a wonderful thing. It means you have the physical and mental strength to keep wearing that armor. It’s not about which is better or worse. Whichever you choose is fine.

Those are very convincing words coming from someone like you, since you chose to take off your armor and experienced the relief that comes along with that. What kind of person is the real you?

Well… Another thing that confused me when I became an idol was that it became harder to sing songs about romantic relationships. Until then, I thought it was good to sing about things I felt based on my own experiences. But our fans support us with such enthusiasm and romance is considered taboo for idol singers, and I don’t want to make my fans sad. It’s about establishing a relationship of trust with them. So I overcame this barrier by being up-front and declaring loudly that “I want to get married someday!” [Laughs] Because it’s true that I want to marry and have kids someday. Rather than suddenly announcing it and shocking people, my plan is to get my fans used to the idea that “she wants to get married.” At this point, my fans seem to worry about me and ask, “Aren’t you marrying yet?” [Laughs]

You’ve been an idol for nine years, keeping at it while resolving the things you feel confused about in your own way. Is there anything you take care to do to continue working for a long time?

I think I was always worried about the shelf life of an idol, thinking that if I didn’t achieve results after making my major label debut, I’d be replaced by the younger next generation. But somehow I’ve been able to continue for nine years. The key to that has been not to overwork myself. Even if the other person has no bad intentions, you should be ready to say “No” and take care of yourself when you feel mentally tired or when you feel like you’re not heading the way you want to go.

It’s true that being young is still considered important in today’s idol scene.

Youth is a really powerful thing with its boundless energy and enthusiasm, but I think Philosophy no Dance right now is also in really good condition. We might not have that drive of being young, but we’re calmer grownup women, you know? We’d really like people to check us out.

Why are you able to continue doing what you do with such sincerity?

I went through some mental health problems once. When that happened, I stopped and thought about what I really wanted to do, and decided that the biggest goal in my life was to keep doing music. I figured out what’s most important to me, so I quit all my part-time jobs and the priorities of my various choices from that point on became clear.

You advocate mental well-being in the podcast “B-side Talk” which you host. Are there any episodes you remember in particular?

They’re always interesting, but during the episode on “Sports and Mental Health,” I learned that placing winning above all else can be one of the factors that causes mental distress for athletes, and thought that the concept also has a lot in common with the world of idols and entertainment. The desire to “make it big” can be an effective stimulant, but it can also wear you down mentally. So it’s important to enjoy what you do without being too obsessed with achieving results. I was surprised to find that many of the things I thought were far removed from my own genre were actually connected in terms of mental well-being.

Sony Music Entertainment Japan has been expanding a project called “B-side” that provides support for artists and creators in the entertainment industry, both mentally and physically. I understand that they offer a variety of programs, including counseling. What did you think when you first heard about this system?

I was genuinely happy. As an artist, it’s something to be grateful about, and it’s reassuring to know that we’re being cared for as people, rather than being consumed as products. I actually went in for counseling. I’d never really heard of counseling before, and didn’t have any particular problems, so I was wondering if it was OK to go ahead with it. I thought counseling was something you went to receive advice on whether or not your concerns were right or wrong, and what you should do about them. But when I actually experienced it, counseling felt more like a conversation with myself. Talking to myself helped me to organize my thoughts, and it was like the counselor paved the way for me to find answers like the things that were bothering me or that I was worried about. If anyone has vague, unsettled feelings, I think counseling can help you untangle the knots in your mind.

—This interview by Rio Hirai (SOW SWEET PUBLISHING) first appeared on Billboard Japan

AFSHEEN, a recording artist, songwriter, producer and DJ based in LA, has just released a new album called SMALL WORLD. One of the lead singles from the album was “No Muse,” which he wrote and sang together with HARU NEMURI, a Japanese singer/songwriter who has been well-received overseas and has recently concluded her successful North America tour. 

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The song is a distinctive fusion of drum and bass with HARU NEMURI’s richly imaginative singing. It is dedicated to the Woman, Life, Freedom movement of AFSHEEN’s home country, Iran (readers will recall that Iranian human rights activist Narges Mohammadi won the Nobel Peace Prize in 2023).

In September 2022, a young woman named Mahsa Amini was taken away by police for not wearing a hijab. She was later found dead. This re-sparked the movement, and AFSHEEN sought to depict this tremendous struggle for the people whose freedoms are being taken from them.

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In an interview with Billboard Japan, the two artists spoke about the creation of “No Muse” and discussed making connections through music and “making the world smaller.” (This interview was recorded in late September 2023.)

How did you two meet and come to work on “No Muse” together?

AFSHEEN: I met HARU through Justin, who is interpreting this interview. When he came to my studio the first time, he played me some of HARU’s videos. That was the first time that I saw her, and I just fell in love with her music.

Her music is so unique, and there was something about it that I’d never felt before. So I really wanted to work with her in some way. Then, a while later, I put out the song “God Is a Woman,” inspired by the Woman, Life, Freedom movement. Her team thought that maybe she could do a new version of that song. We talked with each other over Zoom, a lot like this interview, and we decided to make a whole new song from scratch. This is how it was connected to birth of the idea of creating “No Muse”.

HARU, what was your impression when you first encountered AFSHEEN’s work?

HARU NEMURI: A lot of AFSHEEN’s music was in genres that I’ve never worked with before, so at first I couldn’t really imagine what kind of music we could make together. But once we decided to make a new song from scratch, AFSHEEN sent over a demo, and it felt like an abstract landscape. Given the feel of the music, I came around to think that I’d be able to write something for it. What AFSHEEN sent over came from a totally different direction than what I’d been imagining, so I found it really interesting.

AFSHEEN and I have very different personalities and energy levels, but I felt this sense of unity in the world evoked by the track. It was like I realized that two people who are so different had this common ground. I’d been under the impression that there wasn’t anything AFSHEEN-like within me, but actually there was a lot. And, on the other side of that, I didn’t think that there was anything of me in AFSHEEN, but there was. My impressions changed because of the project.

AFSHEEN: That’s so beautiful. That’s what I’m trying to do with SMALL WORLD. It’s about taking a step outside of your comfort zone and having the courage to explore what you don’t know. A lot of people are scared to try something new. I feel a lot of respect for HARU and her artistic sensibilities, and it’s beautiful that she trusted me and tried to create something unique. The core of music comes from the heart, and that’s where real connections are made. Heart to heart and soul to soul. What’s important isn’t what it sounds like, but how it makes you feel.

In AFSHEEN’s part, there’s this one phrase that really stands out, “No muse but the music,” which is even used in the name of the song. I feel like that connects to the theme at the heart of the song. Could you talk a bit about the title, “No Muse,” and about this line?

AFSHEEN: When HARU heard the song I sent her, she just said “No muse.” It started there. When you’re writing songs, there are some things you just can’t explain. You just feel them. When she said that, I was like, “Let’s start with that.” Then she sent back her demo, which had the phrase “No muse,” and I felt like I had to make that the chorus.

For me, personally, “No muse” isn’t true, because, first and foremost, music is my muse. Also I have someone who is my muse, in a way. But I had to run the music through the filter of the women of Iran, who feel like they have no muse. So I sang “No muse” myself. But the music keeps me going. Most of the time, I don’t like to describe these things because I want the audience to take it in and make it their own. But I do love that line. I’d even like to make merchandise like a shirt that says “No muse but the music” on it. I think that would be wonderful.

So HARU came up with “no muse?” HARU, what did you mean with that line?

HARU NEMURI: I think that there are times in people’s lives when they’re suddenly saved by art. The landscape I imagined, with its android goddess, captures that moment. In that moment of salvation, it feels like a religious experience, like there is a goddess present. But the reality is that you’re not being saved by some sort of mystical force, but by the art before you. You were saved by the fact that someone existed and created that art.

I don’t have any problem with people calling someone their muse, or using muse in their personal relationships, but I want to free people from this sense of being saved by something mystic. When I wrote the lyrics, I tried to depict what it would be like to be standing there, alone, in this kind of landscape. The lyrics have a storytelling feel, with room for interpretation. That’s unusual for me, and I hope people also enjoy that part of the song.

We’ve talked about the song’s theme and message, as expressed through its lyrics, but now, using that as a launching point, I was hoping you could speak a little about something deeply tied to the song, Iran’s Woman, Life, Freedom movement.

HARU NEMURI: In Iran, a woman in her early 20s was arrested and questioned by the police for not adequately covering her hair with a hijab, and she died under suspicious circumstances. The Woman, Life, Freedom movement itself had existed in Iran before that, but this news sparked major protests. That’s when I found out about it, seeing it on the news.

I despise systems of controlling people, like nations or societal systems. I truly do. People should have religious freedom, and to worship whoever they want, but when religions or systems become political powers, what we’re talking about stops being simple belief. People die. It needs to stop.

AFSHEEN: I 100% agree. I 1,000% agree. It was one year ago, at this time of the year, when all of this was happening(*). I had gone to five different countries, working on SMALL WORLD, and then I started hearing about this woman who got killed for showing her hair. Then it started snowballing into a revolution, with more kids being killed. It was heartbreaking. When I was coming back to L.A., I knew that I had to do something musical about that. The world is a beautiful place, but it’s also a cruel place. There is so much unfairness. I knew that energy was going to do something, though I had no idea what.

I didn’t know that a year later I’d be here, talking with HARU. That’s what SMALL WORLD is about. It’s how we make the world smaller. HARU, you’re a Japanese artist, so you didn’t have to do or say anything about this, but you did. That means a world to me, and, I’m sure, to a lot of young women that will see this. I pray for true freedom for everybody. We should all have the freedom to do what we feel, as long as it doesn’t harm anyone. I think that’s what my work has to say about the Woman, Life, Freedom movement.

*As mentioned previously, this interview was conducted in September 2023, roughly one year after the death of Mahsa Amini.

AFSHEEN, in making SMALL WORLD, you collaborated with artists around the world. HARU NEMURI, you’ve also become internationally active, collaborating and touring with overseas artists. How do you two feel about venturing out from the countries you’re familiar with and working overseas?

HARU NEMURI: I think that, for any given country, there’s only a certain percentage of people who really need my music. Going to a lot of different places increases my likelihood of encountering that small percentage of people in any given country. I also don’t like staying in the same place for a long time. I want to travel to alot of different places.

But I feel like the situation in Japan is an unusual one. In any country, most musicians aren’t going to be in the superstar camp or in the “We just started out and we only have five fans” camp. But in Japan, the musicians in this middle area, the largest area, never leave Japan. There are a lot of musicians who have no particular reason to tour outside Japan, but who also have no particular reason not to tour outside Japan. I always wonder why they don’t go, especially when I look at overseas artists.

What about you, AFSHEEN?

AFSHEEN: I think it’s important for every artist to be able to open up and collaborate with other artists. It’s important to be able to go to other markets or cities or countries where you wouldn’t normally have an audience or fans. It will expose your music to more people, and make the world smaller. That’s the true message of SMALL WORLD, and the essence of who I am as a person. I love to see people from different backgrounds and countries and genres coming together. What makes music so exciting is the way it brings us together. I feel that it’s important to step out of what you know and expand your world.

Then, in closing, was there anything in this collaboration that inspired you and that you think will influence your future activities?

HARU NEMURI: In “No Muse,” I put storytelling and the depiction of the song’s landscape first and foremost, which is very unusual for me. I think that’s because usually I just don’t have the talent for that. That’s why I haven’t made any attempts to do it out in public. However, now, having tried it, I realized that I wasn’t able to do it because I didn’t have a clear visual picture myself. I discovered that I could write lyrics as long as I had my own clear picture. I’d like to refine my own sensibilities so that I can get a clear picture in mind before I start.

AFSHEEN: That’s beautiful. I think that’s the key point of collaborations. If we can walk away as better writers and better artists, I think the collaboration was a success. I would never have thought of doing a vocal duet, but the fact that HARU enjoyed “God Is A Woman” gave me power and encouraged me to sing the chorus. Thank you for liking my voice. If it weren’t for you, I might never have done what I did.

—This interview by imdkm first appeared on Billboard Japan

Japanese retailer PARCO Co. Ltd. is celebrating the 55th anniversary of the PARCO shopping complex with a special ad featuring musician Haruomi Hosono, the late visual artist Keiichi Tanaami — who died in August at age 88 — and his first disciple Naohiro Ukawa.

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Carrying on his mentor’s legacy, Ukawa directed the HAPPY HOLIDAYS Campaign that also marks Hosono’s 55 years in music, with an epic historical mandala blending rare photos from his childhood through to his works with Happy End, YMO, and up to the present day with the iconic motifs and characters by the internationally acclaimed artist and graphic designer Keiichi Tanaami. 

“I feel greatly honored to have been asked to participate in this memorable 55th anniversary of PARCO as creative director,” Ukawa says. “This project is a cultural mandala that visually fuses artwork by my mentor Keiichi Tanaami, who passed away suddenly shortly after his 88th birthday, with the historical transition of Haruomi Hosono, who also miraculously celebrated his 55th anniversary in the same year as PARCO. The history of PARCO, which has continued to lead the pop avant-garde culture of Japan since its period of rapid economic growth, resonates with the 55 years of time flowing through this mandala, and a cultural mantra emerges… This visual world has a three-dimensional structure with a complex interweaving of such multiverses.”

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Ukawa also serves as creative director for the commercial that celebrates Hosono’s 55-year music history using generative AI technology to bring photos and Tanaami’s signature motifs to life, accompanied by Hosono’s original music and narration to ring in a special holiday season.

“By some amazing coincidence, my music career began in the same year that PARCO was founded, 55 years ago,” says Hosono. “I prayed for ‘Happy Holidays’ while composing this music.”

Ukawa adds, “Sealed within this mandala is a present-century continuation of creativity, in which the disciple completes a work by allowing the departed mentor and his style to possess him, making full use of both extremes — the physical body and cutting-edge technology — such as hand-drawn artwork x CG and hand-drawn animation x generative AI. This incredibly deep and psychedelic visual world has reached a clear ceremonial realm and is a microcosm of post-war Japan’s alternative culture, where fine art and pop culture are chaotically mixed together!!!!!!! Happy 55th anniversary to PARCO and Haruomi Hosono!!!!!! And a massive RIP to my mentor, Keiichi Tanaami…”

Related events will accompany this project, including a screening of a documentary film about Hosono and a talk show entitled Hosono Cinema House featuring the legendary musician and Ikuko Harada to be held at White Cine Quinto on the 8th floor of Shibuya PARCO in Tokyo Nov. 7. A special program on Tanaami aired on Dommune hosted by Ukawa on Oct. 28 and another one on Hosono is set for Nov. 9.

Various other related events are planned for the holiday season, with further details to be announced Dec. 2.

In a year when creative content from Japan is attracting attention in global markets, a singer with potential for international pop stardom has appeared in the J-pop scene. The budding artist’s name is Hibiki, and she sings the festival song “Desire” for the 37th Tokyo International Film Festival (TIFF 2024), one of Asia’s largest film festivals.

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Based in Kyushu in southern Japan, the young singer enrolled in university in April this year. She co-wrote “Desire,” her debut single released Oct. 23, an up-tempo dance track with Jersey club beat and lyrics all in English. “I know you are just a hater,” Hikibiki sings with her emotive, resonant voice, unleashing her thoughts on haters and online flame wars. A portrait of a strong young woman comes across from skillful vocalization and determined gaze, ready to step out onto the global stage.

Billboard Japan chatted with the rising star, who remains mostly shrouded in mystery with little background information available, about her musical roots and future goals as an artist.

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What are you studying at university?

Sustainability tourism. Simply put, it’s about things like Sustainable Development Goals (SDGs) and regional development through tourism. Most of the students at my university are doing interesting things; I have friends who have launched student groups and businesses. A professor there is a former UN employee, so we get to hear the inside story of how the SDGs were created.

Were you drawn things like singing and entertainment from a young age?

Yes, I’ve loved music since I was little. I started fiddling with the Electone electronic organ when I was two and started learning how to play it properly when I was three. I apparently said I wanted to play music myself.

Which artist do you remember liking in a conscious way?

My dad would play music in the car, and I used to sing along to the Spice Girls’ “Wannabe.”

How did you learn English?

I started going to English conversation classes when I was a toddler, and used to enjoy English in a game-like way. But I was bad at it as a subject from junior high to high school and couldn’t keep up. I’m working hard now. [Laughs] I’ve been familiar with English for a long time, though, so I can pronounce words kind of like a native speaker.

What other instruments besides the electronic organ do you play?

When I was in junior high, I joined the brass band and played the flute and percussion for three years. There were only nine of us in the band, so we changed parts depending on the song. In first year junior high, our brass band was given the opportunity to perform as the opening act for [J-pop megastars] DREAMS COME TRUE. That was a wonderful experience.

What kind of music did you listen to growing up, starting with the Spice Girls?

In junior high, I listened to [J-pop] artists like Superfly and MISIA. I got into Western music in high school. I had the opportunity to go on a two-week homestay in Canada in my second year junior high. I found out about it through some flyers from school. But the cost of travel and such are quite expensive, you know? We weren’t a particularly wealthy family, but my mother said she wanted me to have an experience that will give me a broad perspective.

That’s something to be grateful for.

That was my first trip abroad. At the time, Ed Sheeran’s “Shape of You” was popular. The experience reminded me that I like English. You can communicate with people from different cultures, and above all, the music is so cool. At the time, I enjoyed music on YouTube.

What made you want to become an artist or singer?

I’ve always loved to sing. Then one day, I had a sudden urge to learn how to sing. I wanted to get a bit better at it, even as a hobby. I was in the chorus in high school and also started taking vocal lessons on the side. I started to think that singing on stage was fun, and that it’d be nice if I could make a career out of it.

In high school? That’s pretty recent.

Yes, it is. I started auditioning and entering contests from there. That’s how I first got started, which led to where I am today.

It goes to show that being able to take action and taking the first step is important.

Whether I passed or not, my views in terms of music broadened through the experience and left a deep impression on me. The fact that more and more people said they like my songs gave me confidence.

By the way, are there any singers you look up to as role models?

I’d say Dua Lipa. She has a voice that no one else can imitate, and her songs have a retro feel to them. I admired her amazing performance at the Grammys. Dua Lipa has this beautiful way of expressing things through the lingering sound at the end of her words. Also, if we’re talking about songs, Zedd is another favorite. I went to my first-ever music festival this year, GMO SONIC, and he was awesome. I also like Tyla and Sabrina Carpenter. I listen to them all the time while I’m going places.

What are you particular about in terms of your own singing and other aspects of your individuality?

I recently discovered that when I sing with feeling, I can make better use of the techniques I have. I try to focus on immersing myself in the world of the lyrics as I interpret them. I think my low voice is my strong point, and I’ve developed techniques that make the most of that.

When did you become interested in writing your own songs and lyrics? 

I recently began understanding the profundity of lyrics through co-writing. The lyrics of songs in Japan are so distinct. It feels so interesting to me.

How did your debut single “Desire” come about?

Producers Mitsu and hito and I made a rough demo in about an hour using “space language” [i.e. fitting random words into a melody], and when the entire co-writing team listened to it later on we all thought was good. So we worked together to make a full-length version straight away.

The opening line, “I know you are just a hater,” has quite an impact. How did you come up with it?

The song was already hard-hitting when it was still a demo, so when I was singing it in space language, I was thinking about making the most of that slightly hateful feel it had. We’d changed the song’s title to “Desire” from the temporary one and I’m glad the lyrics connected to that word.

How did “Desire” become the festival song for TIFF 2024?

While we were working on the song, hito, one of the producers, said, “I have a feeling this will work!” and pitched it. I was so happy when it was chosen. The entire process of the tie-in becoming a reality was really quick.

The timing couldn’t be better, since Hiroyuki Sanada’s SHOGUN won a record 18 Emmy Awards and global interest in talent from Japan is on the rise.

The media was filled with articles about that alongside the news about “Desire” being chosen as the TIFF 2024 song. That was amazing.

What sort of artist do you want to be in the future?

I want to become someone like the Asian version of Dua Lipa, but since I’ve loved singing since I was little and love music, I don’t want to end up just idolizing someone. I want to become someone else’s idol next.

—This interview by Fukuryu first appeared on Billboard Japan

Billboard Japan’s Women in Music initiative launched in 2022 to celebrate artists, producers and executives who have made significant contributions to music and inspired other women through their work, in the same spirit as Billboard’s annual Women in Music celebration that has continued since 2007. This interview series featuring female players in the Japanese entertainment industry is one of the highlights of Japan’s WIM project, with the first 30 sessions published as a “Billboard Japan Presents” collection by writer Rio Hirai.

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Ayaka Wada chatted with Hirai for the latest installment of the WIM interview series. The former member of the Hello! Project idol group Angerme currently continues her music career as a solo artist while also actively sharing her thoughts on art and feminism. The 30-year-old elaborated on the discomfort she felt as a member of a popular idol group and on why she is vocal about changing the norms of the industry and society now that she is free to speak her mind.

You began your career as an idol performer when you were 15 years old. How did you end up going down that road?

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I auditioned for Hello! Project when I was in fourth grade and started out as a trainee. After five years of training, I made my debut as a member of S/mileage in 2010. The group later changed its name to Angerme and I also experienced being the leader.

Before you actually made it, did you long to become an idol?

You know what, I never aspired to become an idol. My dad is a doting parent, and he was like, “My child is cute so she’ll be accepted anywhere,” and kept sending in applications without asking me. I was shy around new people and bashful, so I was like, “I can’t stand on stage and sing and dance!” and was thinking of quitting when I entered junior high. But as I was thinking how I didn’t want to get in trouble with my parents, I ended up making my debut, and before I knew it, I’d come to a point where I couldn’t turn back. My environment changed after my debut and I had to interact with more people, so that made me more responsible. I felt that as long as there were people paying to see us, we had to make sure we didn’t mess up.

So you ended up becoming an idol group member without really intending to. Were you able to fit in with the image of “idols” that people around you expected?

Being “idol-like” has a lot in common with the concept of “femininity.” You have to keep your legs closed and not cross them, you have to keep smiling, you’re discouraged from expressing your own opinions and talking about politics or religion is strictly forbidden. It felt like society’s old-fashioned gender roles were still deeply rooted in the industry and being expected to be idol-like, i.e. feminine, made me feel more and more uncomfortable. So I kept thinking that I had to overcome this somehow or I wouldn’t be able to live as myself as I continued my idol career.

Did you ever feel uncomfortable with your femininity outside of your work as an idol?

I used to go to Tokyo from my hometown when I had work, but moved there when I entered university. From then on, it felt like I’d been thrown into society, and I became more and more aware of my gender as a woman. I was attending a women’s university and used to wear whatever I liked without worrying about how men saw me, but was often approached on the street at night when wearing pink or floral clothes and it was scary… I thought, “Maybe this is the wrong way to dress,” and started wearing jeans and T-shirts, and wasn’t approached on the street when I did so. I thought this was connected to the discomfort I felt about femininity. But at the time, I wasn’t able to verbalize that I was being forced to conform to the idea of femininity that people around me had in their minds, and it’s like I’ve always been searching for and researching the true nature of the discomfort I felt in my life and in my idol career.

How did you figure out the true nature of the discomfort you were feeling?

I learned about feminism at university. It was a women’s university, so there was a lot of emphasis on women’s education, and there were classes that helped us think about how to build a career that would allow us to become independent. In the French art classes I was taking, I also learned about how artists had been treated according to their gender. The biggest shock I got was when I learned the famous line, “One is not born, but rather becomes, a woman” from Simone de Beauvoir’s The Second Sex in a French literature class and realized that this was the reason of my discomfort. After that, I went to the library and read all kinds of books on feminism.

You were a member of Angerme at the time, so you must have been living with a disconnect between that knowledge you were inputting and the required output in your work life.

My feelings and actions were always completely the opposite. While going back and forth between these opposing views, I discovered that idols are social existences rather than individual ones. I tried my best thinking I could change the world of idols too somehow, but it was hard to do by myself. I decided to “graduate” from the group because I thought that I couldn’t realize what I wanted to do while I still belonged to the company.

What did you do to approach those concerns?

While idols are existences that are produced, each person wants to express something different, so I was hoping we’d be treated as individuals, including during our private lives. Being young, innocent and cute was considered important, and growing up wasn’t a good thing. We couldn’t even grow out our bangs. Under those circumstances, I continued to take a grassroots approach like making leaflets saying, “Why can’t I express myself as I am?” and handing it out to the staff. I didn’t get any outward response, but there was a staff member who told me secretly that they “all passed it around and read it.” That was in 2018 and the concepts of “diversity” and “gender” weren’t as well known in (Japanese) society as they are now, so my actions may have seemed abrupt. I’m starting to notice changes now. There are more variations in expressions such as hair and makeup and costumes. Labor standards are also being questioned, and I’ve heard that more and more talent agencies are setting up mental health consultation services.

When you decided to go solo, what kind of message did you want to send out to whom?

People belonging to a younger generation than myself. When I was in a group, all my comments about feminism were cut. “I want to consider how women should be,” was the limit. But I want to think about the issues of idols and feminism, and to create a working environment where everyone can have peace of mind. The thing that surprised me the most about making those kinds of comments after going solo was the support I received from my fans. On social media, there are still people who don’t think well of women who speak out, but I know now that I have lots of allies and feel that as long as I have these people I can continue to speak out.

It must be reassuring to feel the presence of allies around you. There may be people out there who struggle because they can’t find like-minded communities. What do you think should be done in such cases?

It’d be best if you could connect with people in real life, but now, “in-person” isn’t your only option. When I was an idol, I didn’t use the word feminism when talking with the other members and felt lonely sometimes, but it helped to look at posts on social media by people who felt the same way as me. So, even if you can’t connect with people in real life, I hope you find another place where you can belong. Books and art can also become places where your mind can belong, and you’ll feel protected. When you come across someone with different views, express your feelings by saying, “I don’t think so” without getting swept away, and that simple comment can protect your mind. In my case, I release the emotions that have built up in my mind by putting them into words as song lyrics.

How do you think we can eliminate gender imbalances within the entertainment industry as a whole?

I want people who are in the public eye, the staff members, and the fans, regardless of gender, to join this conversation. If we can visualize what everyone is thinking, including men as well as women, then I think changes will take place. 

—This interview by Rio Hirai (SOW SWEET PUBLISHING) first appeared on Billboard Japan