Music

After dropping a career-spanning live album (2024’s Then And Now) and joining fellow gospel greats Fred Hammond, Yolanda Adams, and The Clark Sisters on Kirk Franklin’s arena-visiting Reunion Tour, Bishop Marvin Sapp made a move few in the gospel world saw coming – releasing an R&B EP just in time for Valentine’s Day (Feb. 14). 
Aptly titled If I Was An R&B Singer, the new EP is a notable – but momentary! — genre pivot from one of the most decorated voices in contemporary gospel music. An 11-time Grammy nominee, Sapp has sent a whopping 14 titles to the top 10 of Billboard’s Gospel Albums, including 2007’s Thirsty and 2010’s Here I Am, both of which spent over 20 weeks atop the chart. He’s also earned four chart-toppers on Hot Gospel Songs, led by 2007’s seminal “Never Would Have Made It,” which achieved rare crossover success, reaching No. 14 on Hot R&B/Hip-Hop Songs and No. 82 on the all-genre Billboard Hot 100. His most recent Gospel Songs chart-topper, 2020’s “Thank You for It All,” was a finalist for top gospel song at the 2021 Billboard Music Awards. 

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There’s always a kerfuffle when gospel artists cross over to secular music, but Sapp’s new EP arrives under special circumstances. First, people have been wondering what Sapp would sound like on an R&B song for years – it’s one of the ways he grounds the EP’s narrative in the intro. (“I wonder,” muses on-air personality Tyrene “TJ” Jackson on the track, “What it would sound like… an R&B song, or a whole R&B project by Marvin Sapp?”) Second, after a 36-year career that’s garnered him billions of streams and numerous historic achievements, Sapp is in a place where he feels comfortable taking risks – even if he doesn’t think they’re as dicey as others might. 

“I sing gospel because that’s my conviction, but don’t think I can’t do what other people do,” he plainly tells Billboard on Valentine’s Day. “I can do it; I just chose a different genre.” 

That relaxed freedom and artistic security shines across If I Were An R&B Singer and its quiet storm-inflected, late-‘80s R&B foundation. Featuring writing and production from a close-knit team, led by his son, Marvin Sapp Jr., If I Were an R&B Singer is an entertaining artistic exercise that never sacrifices or compromises the integrity and overall mission of Sapp’s purpose as a singer and artist. 

In a lively conversation with Billboard, Marvin Sapp details the making of his new EP, his favorite line dances, the differences in vocal technique across genres, and the R&B he used to croon in the school lunchroom.

When did you finally decide to make an R&B project? 

I didn’t sit down and decide to make it; it kinda just fell in my lap. For my whole 36-year career, people have always asked why I haven’t ever sung R&B music or anything of that nature. I always said the reason was that I didn’t feel like it was my assignment. I feel like whenever you do anything musically, there has to be a conviction that’s attached to it. 

My son [Marvin Sapp Jr.] said I should make something like [If I Were An R&B Singer], and his good friend Kolten [Perine] produced the record. I decided to put my career in their hands, more or less, because they’re younger and Gen Z, they get it. 

You touch on this during the intro, but talk to me a little bit more about your experience with R&B while growing up Baptist. 

I grew up in a very traditional church here in Grand Rapids, MI. We didn’t have drums, didn’t have an organ, we had an upright piano, couldn’t rock, couldn’t clap, couldn’t do any of that. When I was a teen, everybody was listening to New Edition because they were a hot group — but I never felt like they could really sing. I was sitting up listening to people like Peabo Bryson, Teddy Pendergrass –who influenced my style in a gospel way – Con Funk Shun and the Dazz Band. These were the groups and singers who shaped me as an artist. That’s who I played around the house. Even though I chose gospel at the age of 10, you know, I was pretty much raised by those individuals. 

When you had someone to sing to in the lunchroom, what songs were you singing? 

I was singing stuff by the Dazz Band like “Heartbeat” and “I’m So Into You” by Peabo Bryson.  My junior year in high school was everything to me because that’s when Between the Sheets by The Isley Brothers came out. I was singing the whole first side of that album. I remember my first major solo at my middle school was “Sparkle” by Cameo. I can count the number of times I’ve sung R&B in my life, maybe 20 times maximum.  

This [project] is a one-and-done. I challenge everybody to get it because it’s not like we’re going to do anything else like this again. I just wanted to try it, and I think I did a pretty good job. 

How did you develop the specific style of R&B you were going for on this project? 

First, I wanted to make sure I didn’t veer too far away from my assignment and my calling. I still want to be the preacher, the teacher, the pastor, etc. I still want to be able to go back to doing what I feel like I do best — and that is singing the Gospel of Jesus. We wanted to make sure that lyrically, it was about love and relationships, but it was clean like a lot of the ‘80s and ‘90s R&B I grew up listening to. I wanted to revisit that particular style and texture. 

I also had a conversation with my son and Kolten about making sure that I didn’t jeopardize who I was for the sake of the project. We came up with something that’s current, sensual, but not sexual. And that was the goal. 

Who else was involved in making this project and when did that process begin? 

It started last year. I built my own recording studio on my property during COVID, so I recorded it there like my last two CDs. The young man who mixed and mastered it, Curtis Lindsey, is actually my [musical director] and has been with me for maybe 17 years. Of course, my publicist Kymberlee [Norsworthy], my son — who co-wrote “Free Fallin” with Kolten and shot the album cover. I’m a very strong believer in using younger gifts that are around you to help you to remain current. It’s very difficult being an artist of 36 years and being blessed to remain relevant – especially when you’re trying to reinvent and introduce yourself at the same time. You have to make sure that you have people around you who really understand the pulse of what’s happening now, and Kolten and Marvin get it. 

Did your approach to singing have any notable shifts between gospel and R&B? 

Singing R&B is more melodic. In my gospel music, I might be hollering at you one minute, and the next, I’m singing softly and doing certain riffs. This particular record is more of me singing and people being able to sing with me to the hooks. We were trying to make sure it was catchy so we could give people the opportunity to hear me in a totally new light and recognize my versatility. I was able to use my falsetto a little bit, which I’m not able to do as much on the gospel side. I could do it, but once you recognize what people enjoy you doing, you just do that. 

How did you come to an understanding of what R&B audiences want to hear in 2025? 

I really studied! Of course, I’ve known Tank for years, and I listened to him. But I knew I couldn’t be a Tank. There’s a new young man [named October London] who I really, really love and listen to a whole not. He sounds like a Marvin Gaye type of artist. I literally sat and studied his music, placement and lyrical content. I listened to people like Joe, old-school Dave Hollister, and so many different people, to create some form of gumbo. I took pieces from each of them. The first song, “Listen,” is kind of a throwback to Kem. I got a clear picture of what people enjoy and what they want to listen to. 

“Free Fallin” has a bit of a line dance moment. Could we be seeing you hit those moves soon? Do you have a favorite line dance? 

I’m still doing the Cupid Shuffle, man. But I’m also learning the dance for [“Boots on the Ground” by 803Fresh]. I know they gonna do it tomorrow night at this event that I’m at. I’ve been on YouTube trying to figure it out. I’ll probably do a [“make your own line dance” challenge] for “Free Fallin” too. 

You said this is a “one-and-done” project, but what do the promotional plans look like for the EP? Is a tour in the works? 

There aren’t plans for me to tour it, because I don’t think that’s my actual assignment. We’re going to definitely see about getting airplay on R&B radio for “Free Fallin,” because I really think that song’s a vibe, to be perfectly honest. But I haven’t even thought that far. I just wanted to do something that was on my bucket list. 

What were those internal conversations with your team like, considering you’re momentarily pivoting to R&B as one of the most highly regarded working artists in contemporary gospel music? 

Kymberlee and I sat down and had a real conversation about it — because we were about to hit the road to do the Reunion Tour with Kirk Franklin, Fred Hammond, Yolanda Adams, and The Clark Sisters. This was a big tour, and we had just dropped my new live album. We talked about [how to handle] putting [the R&B project] out, because we were still on the Billboard charts with gospel tracks. We didn’t want to do anything that was going to jeopardize that. After thinking it through and mapping it out, we decided that this shouldn’t be an obstruction to what we do — especially because our target was to release it on Valentine’s Day. 

There was definitely concern about backlash, but I think that the body of Christ is extremely mature. There are some that will have negative things to say, but those individuals who really know my heart and my passion understand without question that this is something that I’m doing just because I can. I’m not choosing it as a career.  

Do you think there’s something to be said about waiting for the right time to do this project? Would the EP have sounded like this if it came out 10 years ago? 

Heck no! Not even close. 10 years ago, I was still striving to be the best artist that I could possibly be. It’s easy for me to do this – and I don’t want this to sound wrong – because I’m accomplished. I can take risks. Even though I don’t honestly feel like this is a major risk, it’s still somewhat of a risk. 10 years ago, I probably wouldn’t even consider doing this. “The Best in Me” was hot, “Never Would Have Made It” was still at the top of the charts and on the R&B/Hip-Hop charts —  I had already crossed over! [Laughs.] 

Now, I’m focusing on pastoring and opening up another charter school in the DFW metroplex. I’m still making quality gospel music, and I’m still on the Billboard charts. And I’m older, I’m stronger, I’m wiser and I’m better. 

We got a live album and a blockbuster tour from you last year. What do you have planned for 2025? 

I’ve got a Tiny Desk set later this week, and my church in the DFW metroplex is growing by leaps and bounds. I gotta start a second service. I have two grandchildren now. In this particular season of my life, I’m coasting. It feels really good to be able to pick and choose what you want to do and not have to grind like I did for 20 of the 36 years I’ve been out here. 

I’m going to enjoy it because it’s really hard to enjoy the ride while you’re grinding. You miss out on so much and people don’t get it. 

At the height of my career, my wife was sick and dying. I missed out on a lot of things because we were fighting for her life, which was more important than anything I was doing outside of my house. Now, some 14-15 years later, I’m in a different place. I’m still able to maintain a level of success and relevance. I’m enjoying every moment of it now because I get the opportunity to view it from a different perspective.