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It’s a rainy December afternoon in NYC as rush hour approaches. With traffic mounting, Paul Wall opts to walk from Times Square to 5th Ave. to make it to his Billboard interview on time.

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While the Houston legend has traded his fade for a platinum slicked-over haircut, lost 100-plus pounds thanks to gastric sleeve surgery (he wishes Ozempic was around in 2010) and let the salt and pepper fill his beard, it’s still Paul Wall, baby. His signature grills shine bright peering through his infectious grin lighting up any room he enters.

Two decades after the release of his debut album, the 43-year-old’s love for hip-hop hasn’t waned an inch. Whenever he’s home in Texas, he’s recording every day. These days, PW’s even keeping a Notes app filled with sayings and random words he hears like Incandescent or impermanence that he’s just waiting to turn into a bar.

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“I love making music,” he tells Billboard. “I 100 percent intend on doing this until I’m 80 years old. God willing. Especially in hip-hop, our elders a lot of it is they don’t have the opportunity to make music. I don’t take it for granted. I’m 43, so for the next 37 years, there’s going to be albums all over the place.”

It’s not the era of running around with Swishahouse, but Paul Wall’s enjoyed a bit of a renaissance since debuting his viral silver fox look last year while also being championed as the Hotties’ favorite video vixen with his cameo in Megan Thee Stallion’s “Bigger in Texas” video earlier in 2024.

Multiple Billboard staffers even voiced their frustration of missing out on seeing The People’s Champ during his visit to the office last week. Wall’s also brought a new album with him as the slab music savant’s 12-track Once Upon a Grind hit streaming services last Friday (Dec. 13).

“This is really about the journey,” he adds. “A lot of people see the success or finished product, but they don’t realize what it took to get there.”

Check out our interview below finding Paul Wall looking back at Kanye West’s “Drive Slow,” “Grillz” topping the Billboard Hot 100, Megan Thee Stallion and more.

What are some of your early memories of NYC?

My first time performing [in NYC] I remember performing with Dipset. They took me under their wing. The label I was signed to at that time, a lot of people at Asylum and Atlantic were cool with Cam’ron when they were at Def Jam. They were kinda looking out for me. My boy [Joie Manda] was the main one. He was like, “Ay, I’m gonna link you with Dipset. You f–k with them?” Of course, hell yeah. They gave me that New York love. Me and Juelz would be in the studio non-stop. Go out to the club sometimes, perform with them sometimes. We were just enjoying the moment. We had a hell of a co-sign from Dipset. We got a lot of crossover love. 

Take me to the new album, Once Upon a Grind, what do you feel you have left to prove?

I put out an album last year called Great Wall and we kinda kicked off with that one and kept it going. When I’m at home, I’m recording every day. It definitely adds up this way I stay sharp and explore different ideas and avenues I want to go if I want to try something. If I got 500 songs, I got a lot of opportunities. I’m at no loss for bars, I got bars for days. That ain’t it. It’s more how are we gonna deliver the subject matter. P

eople say, “I’ma do this or change this about my life, but I’m gonna start Monday.” Whether it’s saving up for something, working out, starting a diet, I’m not waiting until Monday, I’m starting today. That’s what it’s all about. Set goals and strive to get them. For me, it’s the nonstop grind of working and consistency. I never won a lottery or nothing like that. All I know is the hard work aspect of that.

One thing I heard you say that I do as a writer as well is when you hear a word you don’t know, you’ll write it down.

What, I got a whole list right here. Let me see your list. I got a hell of a list. Some of it’s simple. Incandescent, convoluted, ancillary, cerebral, confound, calamity. Some of these are not too much out there… Impermanence. It will be something I’ll hear on a TV show and be like, “What the hell they say?” Then I’ll say it to Siri. I’ll hit look up the definition and be like, “I gotta find a way to put this in [a bar].” The kiss of ice — I heard of the kiss of death, but I want the kiss of ice. Some of these are just ideas. “Bewildered,” you heard that but you never heard that in a rap. It’s words and random half-bars. “Save the best for first.” 

What do you think about how the rap game stands today and how you fit into it compared to when you broke in?

I still feel exactly the same. I’m a fan of it. There’s a lot of it I’m not a fan of, but I’m not mad at it. I just choose no to listen to it. It’s not my cup of tea, but I’m eternally grateful I had a place here. I love that there’s so many different avenues for artists to not just be one monolithic style. When I was coming up, if you were a region or city and you didn’t sound like you were supposed to sound like, it didn’t work. You were wack. Now you can be from anywhere and sound like anybody. The possibilities are really endless.

I’m a fan of that, even though some of the music I’m not [rocking with]. Some of the production style has changed. Some of it I love. I love the musical aspect of it when people incorporate live instruments or the sampling something musical. Some of my favorite beats are just drums, but I like a variety of it. I’m just happy to be representing for my style. Why complain about what someone else is doing? Make the music I want to make. 

What do you feel you have left to achieve?

So much of it is the longevity. I’ve seen so many people tap out. Some of the greatest tap out. Some people are a perfectionist and if they’re not meeting that standard, it’s a failure for them. I don’t look at it like that. It’s art. I’ve put so many albums and I’ll work on an album with a set of producers and a group of people will love it while another group of people hate it. Then I’ll do an album that’s another style and the group that hated it will love it now. It lets me know I gotta stop overthinking things and you can’t please everyone with every song. Let me give them a variety. I love making music. Let me be the first person to use this in a rap. I 100 percent intend on doing this until I’m 80 years old. God willing. Especially in hip-hop, our elders a lot of it is they don’t have the opportunity to make music. Being that I self-fund my own music, I own my own studio, all my producers are usually my dogs, we’re in this for the same cause. I don’t take it for granted. I’m 43, so for the next 37 years there’s going to be albums all over the place. 

Are you mentoring anyone at all? Do people come up to you and want some game?

Some people I’ll see and I have a lot I want to share with them. I gotta be cautious because everyone might not want my advice. Sometimes people think I got an ulterior motive. That Mexican OT, he’s someone who’s open with what I have to share with him. He listens. I don’t know it all and what worked for me might not work for him. One of the biggest things I learned it is okay to be wrong. I been right about what song’s gonna work — it worked, but it didn’t be work. It’s okay for the label to be right. Even though they wrong, it’s okay for them to be right. 

What do you think about the evolution of white rappers? Do white rappers come to you asking about how they can move in this culture tastefully?

A lot of white rappers come to me. Obviously, Eminem is the big dog, as big as it gets. But he’s out of reach. I’m more accessible. You might bump into me at Starbucks. I would get a lot of people who might be fans of me or my grind not even music. I tell people to be themselves. What worked for me might not work for them. For anybody to be inspired by me means a lot. I also know the sensitivity it takes.

Especially when it comes to saying the n-word. You say it in a rap, and it lives forever. It don’t matter if it’s okay in your hood for you to talk like that. When you get outside of your hood, it’s not okay. That lasts forever and some people don’t really get that until it’s too late. I’m somebody who never said the n-word. There are definitely non-Black people who say the n-word and it’s acceptable in their neighborhood. I strongly tell them it’s not worth losing future things over something you’re saying now. You might stop saying it and you blow up and they go back and it could be a huge deal. 

What do you remember about the week that “Grillz” went No. 1 on the Billboard Hot 100?

I remember we were selling a lot of grills. That was a good week for us. The only time I had did something like that. To be a part of that history moment with Nelly, Jermaine Dupri and Big Gipp. It was huge for me — a huge accolade. One week it was Beyoncé’s “Check On It” with Bun B and Slim Thug, and the next week it’s Nelly with Paul Wall. It’s a proud moment for us to keep representing. I remember Nelly telling me, “It’s gonna be bigger than ‘Air Force Ones.’” I’m like, “Yeah right, he’s just gassing me up.” 

[Nelly] did not have to put me on the song. He’s Nelly, he could’ve gave me a shout-out on the song. He didn’t have to mention me at all. The song is still a hit without me. For him to give me that opportunity, he for sure getting free grills for life. 

How has the grills industry changed?

The evolution has been one path. The grills are monolithic, and people want something different. I got grills a certain way and you’re like, “Hey, why don’t we do it this way?” Me and Johnny are like, “Why not?” Let’s try that. Also with the machines and technology improving, and a lot of the diamond setters having decades of experience, there’s a lot of things they could do now that they couldn’t back in the days. Some of that is your imagination. Now it’s whatever you want. We can do basically anything now.

The week The People’s Champ went No. 1 [on the Billboard 200] it dethroned Kanye’s Late Registration. You even got “Drive Slow” on your album. 

Jay-Z is the president of Def Jam, [I’m thinking] there’s no way he’s gonna let me put that on my album. We’re talking about Kanye West, even though he wasn’t what he is now, he was still a top dog. There’s no way he’s gonna let me put it on my album so it was extremely unbelievable. People made a big deal about me dethroning Kanye, but I didn’t dethrone him — his album just came out before mine. He’s still Kanye. If you look at his album, it sold more than mine. I didn’t dethrone s–t. He really gave me the leg up letting me put that song on my album.

What do you think about “Drive Slow” turning 20 next year?

That’s definitely the song that people ask me most about. Hip-hop fans — not necessarily Paul Wall diehards, but the general public — that’s the No. 1 thing people ask me about. Plain Pat putting it together. He actually tried to sign me to Def Jam but it didn’t work out. He mentored me for a long time. He taught me it’s okay to be wrong. 

First I made Kanye some grills and Plain Pat said, “I seen you made Kanye some grills. He say he f–k with your music and he like your music.” He let me know [my verse not make the album] but this was an opportunity and if it works out this is a hell of a look. I’m not gonna tell the whole world I got a song with Kanye West and it never came out. I didn’t think it was gonna make his album. There’s no way he wants a verse from me. He sent me the beat. The “Drive Slow” verse was the first verse I wrote for “Sittin’ Sidewayz.” 

I always knew this is gonna be something if Jay-Z want me on a song. This is one of them situations. I do it to the beat and this worked. I sent it into him and Plain Pat said Ye liked it and he wants you to come to L.A. and lay it again with him in person. He’s gonna want you to try some new things. Just work with him, he’s a perfectionist. He’s gonna take what you give him and make something out of it.

We flew out to L.A. and we’re coming down the escalators and two sheriffs come up and I’m immediately thinking I’m being Punk’d because Mike Jones just got Punk’d. When you got Punk’d, you’d pass it on. I told everyone, “If y’all set me up, lose my number. You’re not gonna embarrass me.” Next think you know I’m cussing out these L.A. sheriffs. If they reading this, I apologize. I thought they were actors. I’m going hard in the paint talking crazy to them. They have a notorious reputation… We weren’t doing nothing wrong… They left, so I’m like, where Ashton Kutcher at? I’m also thinking Kanye’s in on this.

We go to the hotel and I got to the studio. This is when you had to Mapquest. The driver says it’s right here and we’re in the far left hand lane. There’s four lanes and we’re at a light and the studio’s right there. So you really had to turn right. The driver broke ’em off. He cuts in front of the traffic to turn right and it just so happened there’s a cop in the far right lane. They couldn’t get me plan A at the airport, and now I know I’m getting Punk’d. I’m like, “Get me to the studio.” I’m like, “Can I go?”

He didn’t care what I was doing, and the driver stayed there and got a ticket. I’m upstairs doing my part with GLC and Nas is downstairs doing his verse for the album. I remember leaving, “I don’t know if I’ma make the album.” I’ll never forget DJ Drama called me, “You on the Kanye West album? I’m here at the listening party. You’re on the album!” 

How was your cameo in the “Bigger in Texas” video for Megan Thee Stallion? They’re saying you were their favorite vixen out there.

I’m the Zaddy for sure. Megan is a true visionary. T Farris is her manager, and there’s that connection. She’s somebody we’ve rooted for from the beginning. [I’m] so happy for her success. She definitely deserves all of that, she’s so talented. They reached out and told me they wanted to put a few people in the video. I said, “Of course, I want to be in the Megan video.” She was there in the store with Johnny twerking with her grill. It was a hell of a shout-out to Johnny. She showed us major love for that.