Rock
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The National revealed their upcoming album, First Two Pages of Frankenstein, on Wednesday (Jan. 18) along with its star-studded tracklist.
The project is the band’s ninth full-length studio set is scheduled to arrive on April 28 via 4AD, and will contain lead single “Tropic Morning News” as well as collaborations with Taylor Swift (“The Alcott”), Phoebe Bridgers (“This Isn’t Helping,” “Your Mind Is Not Your Friend”) and Sufjan Stevens (opener “Once Upon a Poolside”).
On the sprightly lead-off track, frontman Matt Berninger croons, “I was so distracted then/ I didn’t have it straight in my head/ I didn’t have my face on yet/ Or the role or the feel of where I was going with it all/ I was suffering more than I let on/ The tropic morning news was on/ There’s nothing stopping me now/ From saying all the painful parts out loud.”
“The idea of referring to the darkness of the news in such a light way unlocked something in me,” he said of the song in a release. “It became a song about having a hard time expressing yourself, and trying to connect with someone when the noise of the world is drowning out any potential for conversation.”
For her part, Swift was thrilled that the secret was finally out, writing, “Ahhhhhh new National album lets gooooo and Sufjan and Phoebe catch me crying on April 28…Extra big hug to folklorian king @aarondessner” on her Instagram Story along with a pre-order link to the album.
The National teased First Two Pages of Frankenstein earlier this week courtesy of a password-protected page on their official website. The unlocked page offered fans a glimpse of Berninger reading Mary Shelley’s Frankenstein on a piano bench, and included a stately letter hinting at the album’s trio of guest stars.
Check out The National’s album announcement below, and the lyric video for “Tropic Morning News” above.
After five years of wishing, hoping and praying for new music from Boygenius — the indie rock supergroup comprised of Phoebe Bridgers, Lucy Dacus and Julien Baker — fans finally have cause to rejoice. On Wednesday (Jan. 18), the trio dropped three surprise new songs and, at last, announced their upcoming debut album via Interscope, a highly anticipated follow-up to their beloved 2018 self-titled EP.
None of the three musicians gave fans any sort of heads-up leading up to their comeback, nor had they given any hint that a full-length album was in the works. (The only indication that something was brewing was an announcement a week prior that they’d be performing together for the first time in years at Coachella 2023.) Instead, Bridgers, Dacus and Baker simply posted Spotify links to the new singles — titled “$20,” “Emily I’m Sorry” and “True Blue” — on Instagram Stories.
News of Boygenius’ return was also run in a Rolling Stone article, which revealed The Record‘s track list and release date: March 31. The article also revealed that Bridgers had initiated a band reunion right after her 2020 sophomore solo record, Punisher, was released.
According to the publication, she’d sent Dacus and Baker “Emily I’m Sorry” after writing it alone, asking them, “Can we be a band again?”
“We were all nervous to bring it up,” Bridgers said. “We all thought that we were more excited than the other person.”
The track list for The Record is as follows:
“Without You Without Them”
“Emily I’m Sorry”
“True Blue”
“Cool About It”
“Not Strong Enough”
“Revolution 0”
“Leonard Cohen”
“Satanist”
“We’re in Love”
“Anti-Curse”
“Letter to an Old Poet”
Listen to “$20,” “Emily I’m Sorry” and “True Blue” below:
Fall Out Boy is back. On Wednesday (Jan. 18), the pop punk group announced its eighth studio album, So Much (For) Stardust, on Ramen/Elektra.
The band — which consists of members Patrick Stump, Pete Wentz, Joe Trohman and Andy Hurley — revealed the album title and its release date via Instagram in an intimate letter to fans.
“‘Time is luck.’ Finish another tour. You reflect but not like a gem in the sun – more like a year long stare into yourself in another airplane bathroom,” the band wrote. “Sometimes you gotta blow everything you were and put the pieces back together in a new shape. The same but different – the foundation dynamited and the dust used to create the concrete pour. I have a tendency to get a little sad whenever I think about anything…but I also feel pure joy when I think that I exist at the same time as whales or that read happens to rise at a certain temperature. And that we happen to be spinning on this little blue rock at the exact same time together. So much (for) stardust.”
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The group captioned the post — which also included the album’s cover art featuring a dog attempting to eat bubbles — “New Album So Much (For) Stardust, produced by Neal Avron, out March 24th.”
The album announcement also arrived with the LP’s first single, “Love From the Other Side,” and its fairy-tale-themed music video.
“Sending my love from the other side of the apocalypse/ And I just about snapped/ Don’t look back/ Every lover’s got a little dagger in their hand/ Love from the other side of the apocalypse/ And I just about snapped/ Don’t look back/ Every lover’s got a little dagger in their hand,” Stump sings on the chorus.
Wentz also offered a little more insight into the album in a press release. “Our band has been an ongoing art project for 20 years, and we know there have been many inception points along that journey,” he said. “We wanted to create an album that merged those points together – something new, but carved from our foundation. Fueled By Ramen and Elektra seemed like the perfect home for this.”
Added Stump in the release: “We wanted to get back to the way we used to work. We wanted to make a record that was really lovingly crafted and deliberate and patiently guided – like someone cooked you a delicate meal. I’m not a very proud guy, but I’m pretty proud of this record.”
Stump also spoke with Apple Music 1 about writing for So Much (For) Stardust, and shared that a large driving force for the album was making sure it was filled with meaning.
“Honestly, for me personally, coming out of the pandemic and just being quarantined or with my family, I was like, if we’re going to do this, and if I’m going to leave again … I was like, it’s got to be, for me at least, it’s got to be with purpose,” Wentz said. “It can’t just be like, this … big show here. Yeah, it couldn’t be that anymore to me … Anybody who loves the thing that they do, their craft, you want to do it for the reason you originally loved. And it’s great actually to me to have these moments where you can reorganize the apartment of your mind or whatever. Life is short and long.”
See Fall Out Boy’s album announcement below and watch the video for “Love From the Other Side” above.
Now that she’s officially a member of the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame, country icon Dolly Parton is calling in some major hitters for her first rock album. During an appearance on The View on Tuesday (Jan. 17), Parton said that after her induction last year — following her initial reluctance to be enshrined alongside life-long rockers — she bent some ears at the ceremony and got started on her first rock album.
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“If I’m gonna be in the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame I’m gonna have to do something to earn it,” she told the show’s hosts, noting that her in-process sessions for the album, Rock Star, include some of the icons she met that night. After co-host Joy Behar said that the album is slated to feature covers of Led Zeppelin’s iconic “Stairway to Heaven” and the Rolling Stones’ “(I Can’t Get No) Satisfaction,” she wondered if Dolly’s old pal, Stones singer Mick Jagger, might make a cameo on his song.
“I’m doing my best to try to get him on, but I did his song anyway,” she said. “I think P!nk and Brandi Carlile are going to be singing on that particular song with me.” She then ticked off who is definitely on board, an A-list roster that includes Paul McCartney, Stevie Nicks, John Fogerty, former Journey singer Steve Perry and Aerosmith singer Steven Tyler. Parton said she’s also been searching around for the right song she can sing with Cher.
“That’s gonna be a big thrill, I think,” she said of a potential duet with the “Believe” singer. In a Tonight Show appearance in Dec., Parton said the album would be a mix of originals (including one called “Rockin’”) and cover of songs by Prince (“Purple Rain”), Journey (“Open Arms”) and Lynyrd Skynyrd (“Free Bird”).
Watch Parton talk about her rock album on The View below.
Christina Applegate took to social media on Tuesday (Jan. 17) to spill the tea on how one of Scott Weiland‘s suits ended up in her daughter’s possession.
“Just a fun fact, the suit my kid is wearing was Scott Weiland’s suit from one of his solo album covers,” she wrote on Twitter alongside a photo with her daughter Sadie at the Critics Choice Awards. “Scott gave my husband, Martyn, that suit long ago in the glorious 90’s… Also we were quite a pair last night. She fractured her ankle this week, hence the boot, and me…MS.” In the photo, Applegate — who revealed her multiple sclerosis diagnosis in 2021 — leans on a cane while her daughter wears a mask with a black pageboy cap pulled down over her eyes and a boot on her fractured foot.
The late Stone Temple Pilots frontman released his debut solo album, 12 Bar Blues, in 1998. And indeed, the pinstripe suit 11-year-old Sadie Grace LeNoble is wearing in Applegate’s Twitter snap is a dead ringer for the ensemble Weiland is sporting in the cover art for the album’s lone single, “Barbarella.” (The song became a minor hit upon release, peaking inside the top 40 on the Alternative Airplay chart.)
Applegate’s husband, Martyn LeNoble, was the founding bassist of Porno for Pyros, the Perry Ferrell-led band that surely ran in the same circles as Weiland.
Weiland, who died in 2015 due to an accidental overdose, went on to release three more solo albums in between his work with Stone Temple Pilots, Velvet Revolver and brief side project Art of Anarchy. His sophomore solo effort, “Happy” in Galoshes, came in 2008, a full decade after its predecessor’s release, followed by 2011’s The Most Wonderful Time of the Year and 2015’s Blaster with backing band The Wildabouts.
Back in 2021, Dark Pictures announced it was developing a motion picture, titled Paper Heart, based on Weiland’s life.
Check out Applegate posing with Sadie in Weiland’s threads below.
Just a fun fact, the suit my kid is wearing was Scott Weiland’s suit from one of his solo album covers. Scott gave my husband, Martyn, that suit long ago in the glorious 90’s Also we were quite a pair last night. She fractured her ankle this week, hence the boot, and me…MS pic.twitter.com/5rqv7d4chb— christina applegate (@1capplegate) January 17, 2023
Lizzo, Kendrick Lamar and Odesza will headline this summer’s Governors Ball Music Festival. The New York event announced the full lineup for this year’s fest on Tuesday morning (Jan. 17), including news that it is moving to Flushing Meadows Corona Park, a green space that has previously hosted two World’s Fairs and the annual U.S. Open Tennis Championship.
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Among the other 60+ acts slated to perform from June 9 through June 11 for the 12th edition of the festival are: Lil Uzi Vert, Haim, Diplo, Omar Apollo, Kim Petras, Joey Bada$$, 070 Shake, Lil Baby, aespa, Rina Sawayama, Lauv, Oliver Tree, Finneas, Kenny Beats, Lil Nas X, Giveon, Sofi Tukker, Pusha T, girl in red, Central Cee, Tems and PinkPanthress, among others.
After a long run at Randall’s Island through 2021 and two years at Citi Field, the move to Corona Park will feature a return to a parkside setting with shade trees and grassy fields, as well as easy accessibility via multiple public transportation options and a new collaboration with Queens Night Market, which will bring a number of Night Market favorites to the festival as vendors.
“We’re big steppers here in Queens, and we couldn’t be more excited to welcome Kendrick Lamar, Lizzo, Odesza and a litany of other iconic artists to Flushing Meadows Corona Park for Governors Ball 2023 this June,” said Queens Borough President Donovan Richards Jr. in a statement. “Beyond hosting some of the world’s most popular musicians and enjoying the economic activity that Governors Ball will generate across Queens, we’re also deeply grateful for the festival’s partnership with local organizations like the Queens Night Market, [non-profits] Chhaya and Elmhurst/Corona Recovery Collective to elevate our local food vendors and our community groups doing critical empowerment work every day.”
The Ball will invite young musicians from the local community to perform, with future stars from School of Rock Queens and School of Rock Brooklyn kicking off the show on Friday and Saturday.
This year will also include the introduction of the GA+ ticket, which will include access to air-conditioned bathrooms, an exclusive, centrally located lounge area with shade, seating and its own exclusive bar, food vendors and water refill stations. A special presale for 3-day and 1-day GA, plus the new GA+, VIP and platinum tickets will be available exclusively for Citi cardmembers from Tuesday through Thursday (Jan. 19) at 11: 59 a.m. ET here. Fan early access tickets will be available on Thursday at 10 a.m. ET (click here to sign up), with a general on-sale to follow.
Check out the full lineup below.
The iHeart ALTer EGO 2023 show descended upon L.A.’s Kia Forum over the weekend, and Billboard was backstage to bring you every exclusive moment.
In-between sets by Fall Out Boy, Red Hot Chili Peppers, Phoenix and Jack White, Billboard social media coordinator Lucy Blonstein chatted up the likes of Jared Leto, CHVRCHES and more on Saturday night. Below, we’ve rounded up seven moments you have to see from backstage.
Leto revealed backstage that out of all the bands on the lineup, he’d want to collaborate with Muse if his band, 30 Second to Mars, ever got the chance. “Because we’ve toured together before, we love them. Great guys, and I think we’d be an interesting, interesting pairing,” he said, standing in front of a giant portrait of Katy Perry. “Yeah, Muse.”
Billboard was also on the ground to catch Fall Out Boy headed backstage after their nostalgia-fueled set, which included classic hits like “Sugar We’re Goin’ Down,” “This Ain’t a Scene, It’s an Arms Race,” “My Songs Know What You Did In The Dark (Light Em Up),” “Thnks Fr the Mmrs” and more, and even caught a candid Pete Wentz whistling as he made his way through the backstage throngs, his long, bleach-blonde hair tied up in a bun and wearing the band’s own merch.
CHVRCHES, meanwhile, shared their “quite boring” pre-show rituals with Billboard, which happen to include vocal and instrument warm-ups, a couple of cocktails made by touring drummer Jonny Scott and listening to music to “get in the ‘zone’,” as singer Lauren Mayberry said. “And that’s about it,” she added. “But yes, no Satanic rituals yet. Maybe on album five.”
Billboard‘s December 2022 Chartbreaker Rosa Linn was also at the big show, where she performed “WDIA (Would Do It Again),” “Never Be Mine” and TikTok breakthrough “Snap.” The Eurovision competitor posed for our camera after leaving the stage, showing off “#ARtSAKH” painted on the sleeve of her jacket to bring attention to the ongoing blockade between Artsakh and Armenia.
Other famous faces we caught up with backstage included Phoenix, Jack White and Beach Weather. Check out exclusive photos and videos from backstage at iHeart’s ALTer EGO show below.
Jared Leto Shares His Dream Collab
Pete Wentz & Our Backstage POV of Fall Out Boy
Pete Wentz backstage at iHeart ALTer EGO 2023 at L.A.’s Kia Forum
Wes and Alex
CHVRCHES Share Their Pre-Show Rituals
Jack White Backstage
Jack White backstage at iHeart ALTer EGO 2023 at L.A.’s Kia Forum
Wes and Alex
Phoenix Backstage
Phoenix backstage at iHeart ALTer EGO 2023 at L.A.’s Kia Forum
Wes and Alex
Rosa Linn Backstage
Rosa Linn backstage at iHeart ALTer EGO 2023 at L.A.’s Kia Forum
Wes and Alex
Beach Weather Backstage
Beach Weather backstage at iHeart ALTer EGO 2023 at L.A.’s Kia Forum
Wes and Alex
Disney+ premiered its first teaser for Bono & The Edge: A Sort of Homecoming, With Dave Letterman on Friday (Jan. 13).
“Dublin is a real part of our story,” Bono tells Letterman, adding, “It’s in our songs” before the clip cuts to a live performance of 2004’s “Vertigo.” As a montage of the rockers’ journey back to their homeland flashes across the screen, the U2 frontman’s voice can be heard singing, “Hello, hello/ I’m at a place called Vertigo/ It’s everything I wish I didn’t know/ Except you give me something/ I can feel.”
For his part, a bushy-bearded Letterman seems more than happy to be along for the ride, telling the U2 members, “Many nice things have happened for me in my life; this is right at the top of that list.”
Directed by Academy Award winner Morgan Neville, the documentary will debut March 17 on Disney+ and showcase Bono and The Edge‘s special concert performance in Dublin. A release announcing the special promises it will be “part concert movie, part travel adventure plus a whole lot of Bono and The Edge, with Dave’s humor throughout.”
“Recently, I won a radio contest,” said Letterman in a statement. “Winner gets to visit Dublin with Bono and The Edge (radio contest part not true, but I feel like a winner). They showed me around, introduced me to their musician friends, and performed some of their greatest songs in a small theater. It’s a great tour. Get in touch with them ― I’m told there are still availabilities. I’m the luckiest man on the planet. (There are no availabilities).”
The release of A Sort of Homecoming also happens to coincide with the release of Songs of Surrender, the upcoming compilation of 40 tracks selected from U2’s storied discography — including “One,” “Where the Streets Have No Name,” “Walk On (Ukraine)” and many, many more — which have been re-recorded and entirely reimagined by the band.
Watch the teaser for Bono & The Edge: A Sort of Homecoming, With Dave Letterman below.
After managing the late Jeff Beck for more than five years (not to mention decades spent promoting him), Harvey Goldsmith will be the first to tell you the revered guitarist was “always difficult.” But that’s also what Goldsmith feels made Beck so special.
“He was different from the rest,” the veteran British music impresario tells Billboard about Beck, who passed away Tuesday (Jan. 9) at the age of 78, shortly after contracting bacterial meningitis. “He wanted to do things differently. He was never quite satisfied with what he was doing. He was always looking to better himself. He never though he was at his best; he always thought he could do better whilst everybody else was sitting there with their mouths open, blown away [by Beck’s playing].”
Goldsmith managed Beck’s career from late 2008 until 2013, but he began working with him during the late 1960s, promoting shows by the original Jeff Beck Group fronted by Rod Stewart. He brought Beck into projects such as the Secret Policeman’s Other Ball for Amnesty International during 1981 and the ARMS Charity Concerts to combat multiple sclerosis two years later. Goldsmith also worked with Mick Jagger on his late ‘80s solo tour, with Beck — who’d played guitar on both of Jagger’s albums up to that point — initially being part of the band.
“Mick one evening phoned up Jeff and started to go through the set,” Goldsmith says. “Jeff said, ‘I’m not gonna play Keith Richards’ parts on Stones numbers. I don’t care what we play, but I’m not doing that.’ Mick was a bit taken aback by it, and Jeff just pulled out. That was the nature of the beast; he was a perfectionist. He wanted to do it his way.”
It was during late 2008 that Beck approached Goldsmith about managing him, through a mutual friend. “Jeff said, ‘I feel that I’m kind of underrated and not really recognized the way I feel I should be,’” Goldsmith recalls. The promoter knew part of the solution right away. “I said, ‘Listen, I’m happy to help you, but you’re not exactly over-prolific in [touring]. If you’re prepared to get out there, I can help you…not only play but in this day and age but do some promotion as well, talk about it.’ He said, ‘yeah, I’m ready for it,’ and that’s how it started.”
One of Goldsmith’s first orders of business was Live at Ronnie Scott’s, an album and DVD recorded during November at the famed London club. Neither he nor Beck were happy with the sound on the project so Goldsmith put a hold on its release until Beck could remix it to his satisfaction.
“He spent the whole of Christmas into the new year and completely remixed it,” Goldsmith says. “When it was done, I said, ‘Are you happy now?’ He said, ‘yes’ and we put it out and [people] were completely blown away that he was gonna do promotion, ’cause he just didn’t talk to anybody — certainly not the press.
“But that was Jeff. He was a lone wolf in what he wanted and often they didn’t listen to him, and he got very upset about it. So we started this pathway of him working, doing shows, doing promotions, doing radio, starting to build him up again.”
Not surprisingly, Goldsmith amassed memories during his tenure managing Beck, among them the all-star tribute concert for Les Paul during June 2010 at the Iridium Jazz Club in New York, which was preserved as the Rock ‘n’ Roll Party live album the following year. “David (Bowie) and I were friends, and he came to the show and sat down with myself and my wife and said to me, ‘I’ve always wanted to write with Jeff,’” Goldsmith recalls. “I said, ‘Well, now’s the time.’ They corresponded a bit but then Bowie went on to something else and then got sick, so it never happened.”
During 2010 Goldsmith also proposed that Beck play some tour dates with Eric Clapton, his predecessor in The Yardbirds and a friendly rival among the guitar-playing elite. “I said, ‘You’d have to open ’cause Eric’s got a much bigger stature, but you’ve got the room to deliver what you want to deliver,’” Goldsmith says. “We didn’t do many [shows] but they really were a highlight. They were fantastic. Every night Eric would stand on the side of the stage and just say, ‘I can’t beat this. I can’t beat this. I can’t beat this.’ It was really funny. That’s who [Beck] was. He was the guitarist’s guitarist. Every guitarist on the planet loved him.”
Prince was among them, apparently. At the 2011 MusiCares Person of the Year gala honoring Barbra Streisand, where Beck performed with LeAnn Rimes, Goldsmith found himself brokering a conversation — of sorts — between Beck and Prince, who was seated at the same table along with Lea Michele and Misty Copeland. “[Beck and Prince] were looking at each other and nodded,” Goldsmith says. “I went over and introduced myself to [Prince] and said, ‘I did some show for you in London. Say hello to Jeff.’ He said, ‘hello’ and they sat opposite each other at the table, not saying a single word.
“Jeff said, ‘What do I do,’ and I said, ‘Someone’s got to break the ice here. Maybe you should sit next to him and see where you get to. Jeff sat down and Prince said, ‘I love your music and I’d like to do some tracks with you.’ Jeff said, ‘That’d be great.’ Then [Prince] said, ‘I’d love to do some tracks with you,’ and Jeff said, ‘OK, great.’ Then [Prince] said, ‘I’d love to do some tracks with you,’ a third time.’ Very bizarre. And that was the whole conversation. I tried really hard to get the chat going, and all I got out of him was he’d like to do some tracks with him. It was hysterical.”
Toward the end of his managing tenure, Goldsmith was negotiating for Beck and Stewart to reunite for another album after a friendly meeting before a Beck performance at the El Dorado Night Club in Los Angeles. “Rod’s people were closing a deal with Universal to do a series of solo albums. I said to Rod, ‘You’ve done enough of this with orchestras — to get together and do something really down and dirty with Jeff would be fantastic.’ [Stewart] agreed with me,” Goldsmith says. “We spent a good six months planning to do an album together in 2013 and Rod was really up for it, his voice was really strong. The next thing I know I got a call from Universal: ‘We’d rather not do this album.’ I was personally gutted by that, and Jeff was extremely pissed off, as you can imagine.”
Despite Beck’s famed truculence, Goldsmith says there was also a tremendous warmth and empathy that’s been seldom revealed. “He was an amazingly good-natured soul who was a magnet for people in trouble,” Goldsmith says. “He was a good listener and was always helping people. For some reason, people he knew, when they got themselves in a mess — they didn’t know what to do with their music or their career or things in their lives — they would go see Jeff and he’d chat with them. They came away like they’d just been to see the guru.”
And Goldsmith was privy to Beck’s almost equal passion for vintage cars, which he calls the guitarist’s “real love.” “Nothing intrigued him more than tinkering about with oil on all of his fingers and a spanner, trying to put together another classic car,” Goldsmith says. “He literally could take a car and break it down into nuts and bolts and screws and pieces of metal, laid out on the floor, and build a car from scratch. That’s special.”
Goldsmith and Beck had their own falling shortly after that, over a variety of business, creative and philosophical differences. He nevertheless says his time managing the guitarist was “an amazing experience,” and when the two last saw each other during early 2020, “we chatted, hugged, so on and so forth.” He learned about Beck’s death shortly after it happened but was asked not to say anything until after the family made the announcement.
“He was a lovely, lovely guy — just a special character who had the most unbelievable talent,” Goldsmith says. “He really will be…well, he is sorely missed by everybody, already.”
The New Orleans Jazz & Heritage Festival unfurled its 2023 lineup on Friday (Jan. 13) with Lizzo, Ed Sheeran and Dead & Company among the headliners.
Other big names at the top of the event’s roster include Mumford & Sons, The Lumineers, Santana, Jon Batiste, Jill Scott, Robert Plant & Allison Krauss, Kane Brown, H.E.R., Steve Miller Band and more.
The Louisiana-based fest will take place across two weekends from April 28 to May 7 at the Fair Grounds Race Course. Tickets packages come in either a three-day option for $240 on weekend one or a four-day option for $290 on weekend two, with additional early bird and VIP ticketing available while supplies last. Prospective attendees can buy tickets on the New Orleans Jazz & Heritage Festival’s official website.
The seven-day festival will also feature the Congo Square African Marketplace, where concertgoers will find an array of original goods and crafting techniques presented by artisans ranging from the local to the international, as well as the Contemporary Crafts tents in Heritage Square and the Louisiana Marketplace highlighting the state’s vibrant culture.
Sheeran will take the stage in New Orleans in between dates on the upcoming North American leg of his Mathematics Tour, which sold more concert tickets in 2022 than any other act. At the end of May, Lizzo will also headline BottleRock Napa Valley alongside Post Malone and Lil Nas X.
Meanwhile, Dead & Co. will kick off their final tour just weeks after playing Jazz Fest with John Mayer and company starting the nationwide trek at Los Angeles’ Kia Forum on May 19 and 20.
Check out the full lineup for the New Orleans Jazz & Heritage Festival 2023 below.