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Sophia Kearney and Steven Braines were sick of just talking about it. As artist managers and longstanding dance world figures, the U.K.-based pair often found themselves on panels at dance industry conferences discussing the lack of inclusivity in the scene, why things needed to change, and how. Eventually they decided to just do it themselves.
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They started pitching the idea for an intersectional, kind of gritty, sort of loose, pleasantly naughty, fully debaucherous and hopefully transformational kind club night at ADE 2017, taking meetings with marquee clubs including London’s Ministry of Sound, Ibiza’s Pacha and Amnesia and spots in Canada, Berlin and beyond. Every single person they pitched to said yes and offered them a budget to make the vision real.
“I remember, we stood under an umbrella in the pissing rain trying to find the next meeting,” says Kearney, “and we just looked at each other like, ‘Okay, now we have to deliver this in four countries in the next six months.’”
They figured it out on the fly, and in the past six years have turned HE.SHE.THEY. into a traveling nightlife bacchanal of music, dancing and freedom of expression that eschews the corporatization/homogenization of the scene that’s happened in many sectors and instead books every single type of DJ (white/black/brown/straight/gay/trans/cis/queer/male/female/etc.) features every single type of dancer (thick/think/curvy/flat/tall/short/etc.) and welcomes every single type of audience member.
There’s no dress code or impossible door policies. Crowds are only asked to abide by ground rules pasted on the walls of any given venue: no ableism, no ageism, no bodyshaming, no homophobia, no misogyny, no racism, no sexism, no transphobia.
Six years after launching, HE.SHE.THEY. is in the midst of its biggest season yet, with an eight-show residency in the coveted Friday night slot at legendary Ibiza mega-club Amnesia, shows in London, New York, Los Angeles and beyon and stage takeovers at events including the U.K.’s Secret Garden Party. The brand has also launched a record label, with releases by Anja Schneider, Rebekah, Cakes Da Killa, Eris Drew and Maya Jane Coles, the the latter of whom Braines also manages. On Saturday (June 24), HE.SHE.THEY will host a stage at the 12-hour Planet Pride month event taking over New York City’s Avant Gardner, with a lineup including ballroom legend MikeQ, sister house duo Coco & Breezy, RuPaul’s Drag Race star Aquaria and London producer and drag queen Jodie Harsh.
The goal, says the pair — who are funny, down to earth, impassioned and loquacious as they Zoom with Billboard from Ibiza — isn’t to create a night for any one type of clubgoer, but rather to bring all types of people together in a diverse, inclusive, and most crucially, fun, setting. Here, they hope, people will see fellow patrons like themselves and fellow patrons not like themselves, with the intersectionality of lineups and audiences not just fostering fired-up dancefloors, but meaningful, resonant experiences where people learn a bit about each other, learn to be less fearful by people not like themselves and then take those lived experiences back out into the world when the party’s over.
“Hopefully,” Kearney says, “that then trickles out into society, of, ‘OK, well I had a laugh and a joke and a shared musical experience with this person on the dancefloor, maybe I might not need to stare at them. Maybe I might speak up if I see somebody else being horrible to them, because I’ve had this shared experience of realizing that we’re all the f–king same.’”
Tell me about the importance of bringing HE.SHE.THEY to Ibiza.
Kearney: We just feel like Ibiza was lacking a bit of that grittiness, a bit of that sweaty naughtiness that it was born upon and known for initially. And whilst we’re a big fan of going out here, and we have many friends that work at all the clubs, we felt like the danceflooors were maybe — and also this is an overarching reason of starting HE.SHE.THEY. — just slightly sterile in places and a bit more about going to the concert of an artist, rather than being there to discover something about yourself, and everybody else you’re meeting on the dancefloor and getting lost in that musical journey. We also felt a lot of the lineups we were seeing perhaps weren’t as inclusive as they could be.
Doing this at a mega-club like Amnesia and bringing a queer party to a not necessarily explicitly queer space —
Braines: HE.SHE.THEY is queer, but it’s more that queer is one strand of it. It’s about diversity and inclusion, and if anything, intersectionality. If you’re a black trans woman, it should be good. But if you’re a straight white man, it should be good…
My experience, anecdotally — I was originally kind of in the closet and then started going to queer knights, but I had no queer friends. My best friend, who’s a straight Iranian Muslim, used to be the person who went clubbing with me. So I actually know the importance of allyship in that way. And also sometimes, I don’t want to be just in a gay space, like “Oh, because my d–k gets hard for a man means I have to go this club.”
Our friend group is naturally like an ’90s United Colors of Benetton ad. It’s just naturally really diverse. Why would we then have to all code switch on a night out? You don’t have to at work, you don’t have to in the supermarket or the cinema — but then when it’s clubs, it’s like, “This is for you, this is for you, this is for you…”
Tell me what it looks like inside the club on any given night.
Kearney: We don’t have a strict dress code or a door policy, because there are some people who’ve come to our events who might dress in jeans and a black T-shirt for the first party. The next party, you’ll see them they’re experimenting with latex or something because they feel comfortable.
Braines: That safer space thing becomes a ghetto if you don’t have other spaces where people can be more clear and democratized. We don’t like, villainize a straight white man, we’re just saying that the whole pie shouldn’t be for you. And same in queer spaces. It shouldn’t just be for queer sis white males.
Kearney: I’m a straight woman for example, so for me, for the party to be inclusive — one of the most important things for me at HE.SHE.THEY. is seeing different body types. I want to look up and see all different body types sweating and loving it, because I feel like I can lose my inhibitions in that space. And I can take my clothes off and wear a bit less, maybe some days I don’t want to, but some days I do. That’s so important in a space where often I might have gone and just seen only a very specific size and shape and movement style — everything’s for a show, everything’s for the male gaze, it’s all about the guys. Everyone wants to be the male DJ in the booth and maybe wants to date the dancers on the stage…
I still felt a little ostracized in those places — like I wasn’t good enough to be one of those dancers on the stage, and therefore, I would dance in a different way, or I would cover myself. It’s just about, “How can we have as many different types of representation behind the decks and with the dancers, to make the maximum amount of people who are coming through our doors — a crowd that’s then naturally more diverse because of the people that you’re booking and what you’re doing — be able to lose their inhibitions and have that clubbing experience that’s such a release from everything everyone’s going through in normal life?” These spaces are so important now. Just as important as at the beginning.
What are the considerations when putting together a lineup?
Kearney: We still book straight sis white men on our lineups, but they’ll generally only tend to be one on a lineup. We hope to platform other people, and we hope to bring the fans of — let’s say we’ve got Ben Klock, Marcel Dettmann — we hope their fans come and then experience a queer black woman who’s directly supporting them and become a fan of that DJ, and also be surrounded by all different types of people on the dancefloor.
Braines: And also for instance, as a queer guy, I don’t just like queer DJs. The thought is that if you look up at the DJ booth at various points in the night, you might not see exactly you. But in the DJ booth at one time, you’d have seen a female DJ, and quite possibly a trans or non binary DJ, and a male DJ and someone of color.
What are the conversations like that you’re having with the venue operators when bring your party to a place like Amnesia or the Brooklyn Mirage?
Kearney: Every single one is different. We’re in a fortunate position where we were music managers by trade, so we had an existing reputation in terms of being good at what we did. We were constantly being put on all these panels at ADE, IMS, Miami Music Week, where I would be put on as a female manager or exec. Stephen would be as a queer person. Everyone was talking about all the problems, but no one was really doing anything to fix it. I think it was largely because a lot of people who were in power just didn’t know how to do it, and didn’t know how to do it authentically.
After moaning at how we’d been put on all these panels for years, we kind of realized, “Well, actually, I don’t know who else in music has this unique point of being able to have peoples’ ear to explain why it’s important… and also be able to deliver something that isn’t box-ticking or tokenistic — and they know they can get things wrong in front of us or ask questions. We’re not here to shoot anybody down or make anyone feel bad if there’s a genuine willingness for learning and change. We’re not perfect, we’re still learning s— every single time. We get things wrong. We check each other on stuff. It’s an ever-growing process of learning.
But in terms of the conversations, they’re different every time. A club in Amsterdam, for example, might be looking to turn the dial on their inclusivity by having more of a gender split in their audience. Whereas there are other clubs that are very much 50/50 in terms of gender, but perhaps the club hasn’t ever catered to queer people on a Friday or Saturday night. It’s about meeting people where they are and hoping to turn the dial the best way we and they can without it being forced and extreme.
In terms of the political climate in the U.S., are there special considerations when you’re bringing the party here? It’s a transphobic moment, women’s rights are being stripped. Obviously, you’re operating in larger cities where these problems are arguably not as palpable, but is there anything you do differently here because of what’s going on?
Kearney: No, but with with the certain attacks and different things that have happened in the U.S. at queer venues and different stuff, there’s a certain level of risk of something happening at our party on a weapon level level that is very unlikely to happen in other territories. That’s something I think about; it’s something that also makes me feel even more passionate about being there… Again, the education and the welcoming of everybody is surely even more important in those places, because they’re even more likely to need to get along with each other and to stick up for each other, because it is more dangerous.
Give me an example of moments at one of your parties recently when everything was happening, and you were like, “OK, this is exactly what it’s about.”
Kearney: There was one where a guy messaged me ahead of one of the parties and said, “Hey, can I come to fabric and can I have five names on the list?” I was like, “Sure.” He messaged me afterwards saying, “I just had to send you a message, because last time we met I had a girlfriend and I didn’t know I was queer. The guest list I asked for was for my now boyfriend and four of my straight mates. I wanted to come out to them, but I didn’t want it to be this massive deal, and I didn’t want to take them to a queer space. Taking them to dinner felt too formal. So I just said, ‘Hey, I’ve got guest list for this for this night at fabric. It’s these DJs playing, come down.”
He told me that they all came and met each other. He introduced the guy as his boyfriend and they spent the whole night raving together and had a great time. It’s things like that that spur us on, because I don’t know where else they would have done that, if the party didn’t hit point of all the straight mates being like, “Oh, our friend’s invited us to fabric and look at the lineup — I know that male DJ that I’ve seen three times before. I don’t know the rest of the lineup, but my mates invited me.” Then they turn up and some people are dressed in jeans and a black T-shirt, but then there’s a guy standing in a rubber apron with his bum out, and there’s a girl with a harness with her [chest] out and my friend is telling me he’s with this guy now. Like, chill. Great. Let’s get a drink. Let’s have a dance.
I read that DM from him on a train, and I just burst into tears.
You guys are obviously independent. In terms of massive operators in the space – AEG, Live Nation, what would you recommend they do to make their own dance shows more inclusive?
Braines: With Live Nations and AEGs, because they’re so big, I think you need to change and diversify the workforce itself and the decision-makers at all levels. Because then that does naturally elicit some of these things. Some of the big festivals, rather than having a non-branded dance stage that tends to be the same eight DJs or whatever, use a local promoter, or us, or whoever. There’s so many different collectives. Give them a platform; or have your four people you know are going to sell the tent out, and then go and have a few different collectives. Realistically, hardly anyone is coming for the first two hours of a festival [anyways], so you have a lot of plasticity of what you can play with for that opening slot.
Kearney: I try and think, if we’re putting people on at the very beginning, who are those people that can take the building block of saying “I opened for HE.SHE.THEY, I opened for this big DJ.” Who are those building blocks of information and bio and CV things most useful to, so they can go and grow and pitch to other people and get this other opportunity over here.
Braines: Most importantly, no one’s s–t. Never give a platform to someone who isn’t good.
Amid the sports memorabilia in Tim Leiweke’s office, there’s a small framed quote with the word “Motivation” at the top. Leiweke, the chairman/CEO of Oak View Group (OVG), is a 45-year veteran of the estimated global $25 billion concert industry who spent the pandemic building seven new arenas — five of which his company owns and operates — so he’s not one to hang inspirational thoughts from Wikiquotes on his wall. “Motivation” is followed by a question: “How does ASM differentiate itself from its main competitor, Oak View Group?”
The answer comes from Ron Bension, president/CEO of ASM Global, and the most salient part reads: “There are other companies that are noisier, but we’re managing more buildings, with more content from Live Nation and AEG than anywhere else in the world.”
Oak View Group and ASM are indeed competitors in managing facilities around the globe, and it’s important to know that ASM is co-owned by sports/live-entertainment company AEG, where Leiweke was CEO until his “mutually agreed upon departure” in 2013 from the company owned by billionaire Philip Anschutz. Leiweke, 66, says he wishes Anschutz “nothing but luck,” but he also says he carries a copy of Bension’s quote in his backpack and reads it before every presentation he makes. “Never piss off your competitor,” he says with a broad smile. “I thank Ron daily that he has decided it’s me that causes him success. Maybe that motivates me as much as it motivates him.”
In 2015, Leiweke partnered with multisector music magnate Irving Azoff to build a company that now manages approximately 500 facilities. OVG employs 5,000 people full-time (including Leiweke’s daughter, Francesca Bodie, who is president of business development), with another 35,000 part-time staffers.
The arenas OVG has built in the last 18 months include Climate Pledge Arena in Seattle; Acrisure Arena in Palm Springs, Calif.; CFG Bank Arena in Baltimore; and UBS Arena on New York’s Long Island. “We did it in the middle of COVID, inflation, rising interest rates, labor issues, political issues,” he says.
OVG is working on multibillion-dollar projects in Las Vegas; Manchester, England; and, in partnership with Live Nation, São Paulo, and Leiweke says it’s time for the music industry to recognize the crucial role companies like his play in fan satisfaction. “Everyone talks about the promoters, the agents and the managers,” he says. “The brick-and-mortars and the fan experience are equally important. We’re spending tens of millions on acoustics and air-handling systems that deal with things like COVID. And yet people underestimate our passion for how important that is to the live experience.”
“We did a lot of boxing in the AEG days,” Leiweke says. “I’ve got signed globes by Wladimir Klitschko, Lennox Lewis, Oscar De La Hoya. I don’t know how many gloves I have.”
Joel Barhamand
How did you get the Long Island Railroad to open a station at your UBS Arena?
Paid for it. Our landlord and our partner is the state of New York. We went through two governors and a lot of politics to get the deal done. If you look at all the other facilities in the New York area, except for [Madison Square] Garden, Citi Field was built with bonds issued by state and city authorities. The Meadowlands [in New Jersey] was paid for mostly by taxpayers’ dollars. Barclays Center [in Brooklyn] involved bonds. That’s the nature of many of these projects. We were private. Us and [New York] Islanders [co-owner] Scott Malkin put up $1 billion privately to build that arena. Of that billion, roughly $75 million was a cash contribution toward that light rail station. It’s about developing a private-public partnership that works for everybody, which enabled us to get a lot more done there than most anyone else.
The opening of that station has made going to UBS convenient and environmentally friendly. Did sustainability play a part?
We happen to be very sustainable around here. UBS is LEED-certified. Our goal is to make that a carbon-neutral venue within the next couple of years. Obviously, we had the first carbon-neutral arena ever in Seattle. You cannot be carbon-neutral if everyone is driving there for every event. So mass transportation was highly important to us, to get somebody from Penn Station or Grand Central [in Manhattan] in a 30-minute train ride. It was also highly important for the viability of that building in a very competitive marketplace for arenas. You’ve got Prudential Center [in New Jersey], Barclays, the Garden and you’ve got us. We’ve got to find a way to get people in and out without it having to be about the Long Island Expressway.
What is the strategy behind building in secondary and tertiary markets like Palm Springs, Calif.?
There are small markets and big markets, and a combination of those deals is smart. Partially because in North America, the majority of big arenas are owned or controlled by an NBA or NHL tenant. They’re greedy, and they have a strategic value within that market that we don’t have, which is, if you want me to keep this team here, you’ve got to help me build or take over this arena. We’re going to get a few of those — Seattle and New York are examples — but we also have to find either A markets that don’t have an anchor tenant, which are few and far between, or B markets. The business proposition in a B market is just as good as an A market because we can build an arena there for between $200 million and $300 million. I’m not going to get the 86 nights of music that I’m getting in Seattle, but Irving and I can live with 40 nights of music in Palm Springs. And then, we happen to have probably the most financially successful American Hockey League team there this year with the Coachella Valley Firebirds. The mix of those two means we get just as good a rate of return on every dollar I invested at Acrisure as we will in Seattle. We love these B markets because there’s 20 of them out there compared with half a dozen of the A markets.
You’re seeing a lot of growth right now. When does what you do plateau?
It won’t be in my lifetime. There are 50 markets in the world today that need new arenas, but only 20 of them will make sense. I’m very driven by the rate of return that we get on our investment. Irving, the employees and I own the majority of this company. I have an investment partner in Silver Lake, and I’m very driven to get them a healthy valuation on this asset one day because they put a lot of money into it.
Memorabilia from the arenas that OVG has built and the sports teams associated with them. From left: hockey pucks from Climate Pledge Arena and the Seattle Kraken; a plaque from Baltimore’s CVG Bank Arena; a shovel from the groundbreaking for UBS Arena.
Joel Barhamand
You talk a lot about the importance of “alignment” with partners before the work starts. How has that benefited OVG beyond the seven arenas you’ve built?
In Seattle, Climate Pledge Arena was a 50-50 joint venture between us, [Seattle’s NHL team] the Kraken, and [the team’s majority co-owner] David Bonderman. David and I were aligned on that vision for the arena from day one — before he got the team.
That is a city-owned facility, and we continue to be good partners and good neighbors with Mayor Bruce Harrell, Governor Jay Inslee, and county commissioner Dowe Constantine. My brother deals with them every day on our behalf. We’re jumping into Memorial Stadium there because it’s the right thing to do for the city and the county and the school district. And so that alignment with the people I just mentioned has created a hell of an asset. Even though we privatized it, they own it. It has also created all kinds of other opportunities, including our new restaurant, event center and the bid we’re making on Memorial Stadium. And we’re just getting started.
How much of an advantage is it for you that, once you build these venues, you can then bring in Harry Styles or the Eagles because of your partnership with Irving Azoff?
At the end of the day, we’ve got no chips with anybody out there. We’re not promoters, which means we get along with everyone. Louis Messina is one of my best friends. We have known each other most of our adult lives. I have a great relationship with Michael Rapino and everybody else at Live Nation. I like Jay Marciano. I hired Jay. I should be able to get along better with Jay, but there are other relationships at play there. As great as it is to have Irving as my partner, he’s only part of the equation.
Arena builds are not your only business.
We do 16 different services. I probably have 40 people in this company that work with every promoter, including some that route Irving’s tours for him. What makes us dangerous is, we are everybody that wants us to come in and bid because we’ve spent $4 billion building arenas. We’re going to do it better because we’ve got real skin in the game. We raise the debt on each of these buildings through my daughter Francesca and her division. We do the food and beverage, parking. We have a division called GOAL where we learn how to operate buildings more sustainably each year and rate them annually. We have 150 people selling naming rights and sponsorships every day.
How important are VIP packages and services?
We sell premium — suites and club seats. Premium and hospitality are still a huge growth opportunity. We’re just closing a deal on Rhubarb Hospitality Collection, RHC. They’re a high-end catering, food and beverage company based in London, New York and Berlin. They have one of the top restaurants in New York, Peak at Hudson Yards. We’ve also brought on Christian Navarro from Wally’s Wine and Spirits [in Beverly Hills]. When people come into our VIP areas, we want to create a whole different level for them. RHC is my fourth food and beverage company.
You’ve got a massive development in Las Vegas.
The biggest bet we’ve ever made is our project in Las Vegas. You could add New York and L.A. together, and they don’t do as much live entertainment as Vegas. It’s the live-entertainment capital of the world. But let’s look at the venues. There must be 10 nice theaters on the Strip. You need good arenas, too. T-Mobile was my last deal at AEG. It’s a nice arena, but it pales in comparison to what we just built in Seattle, New York and Austin. How do you have the No. 1 live-entertainment marketplace in the world and its arena is not one of the 30 nicest arenas in the country? You’ll hear about this soon, but we have a lot of world-class partners, brands and entrepreneurs who have come together to build out a 100-acre campus that will be the destination for live entertainment, culture, the arts and hospitality.
What does your overseas strategy look like?
The majority of projects we’re working on are overseas, like São Paulo with Live Nation. Thirty million people live in São Paulo. It’s a great music market. Latin music and K-pop are the biggest industry influencers now. We are also highly focused on Singapore and Asia; Lagos, because look at the artists coming from Nigeria. That’s where you’ve got to go for live music and culture and arts. We have a partner from Nigeria to build the single best arena in all of Africa.
You’ve also got Co-op Live opening in Manchester.
That is the capital of the U.K. for live events. That arena is going to be a top five arena in the world. When I opened up Staples Center in 1999, Bruce Springsteen was my opening artist for two nights, and the first night he told everyone, “Why don’t you come out of those corporate boxes and join us.” He didn’t have a great experience. I was like, goddamn it, the Boss just ripped me a new one from the stage. What he told me after the Staples concert is, “Tim, I like hot, sweaty halls.” When he opened up the CFG Bank arena for us in April, I said to him, “You’ve been running around my brain for 25 years because I failed you miserably.” Co-op Live is going to be the first music-only arena that is a hot, sweaty hall, and yet it will have 32 points of destination — restaurants, clubs and VIP spaces. It’s the first time we said, make it about music — make the bowl perfect — and then we’ll shoehorn in whatever else is important outside the bowl. Make all of the people right on the artist so it’s a hot, sweaty hall. I think that arena is going to change our industry. We’re sniffing around in Barcelona and Madrid. We want to go to the great cultural markets of the world where they have arenas that are 30, 40 years old and make those the next flags for the company. We have $2 billion to $3 billion of additional investment coming outside of Vegas and the projects we’re building in the U.S.
What’s your perspective on the Taylor Swift ticketing issue that Live Nation encountered? What could it have done better?
Ticketmaster did nothing wrong on Taylor Swift except for handling the demand, and we all knew that was coming. In a perfect world Taylor, Louis Messina and Ticketmaster would go back, take those dates and spread out the on sales. But at the end of the day it’s the bots and the scalpers that broke that system down. Did Taylor get any money from all of those secondary companies? Not a penny. Did the arenas or stadiums? I’ve spent $4 billion. Why is it that I let a secondary company come into my arena and resell my tickets and keep those fees? It’s a crime.
What are you doing to solve scalping and secondary-market issues?
I’ve got some ideas. In Seattle, we cleansed our season ticket list, our premium list and our club seat list. We got rid of anyone that was a scalper or secondary company so they couldn’t use the right of first refusal on concerts to tie those tickets up. Second is the bots. If an artist wants to be protected, we have to create smart tickets. And one day, your tickets are going to be here. (Holds up his hand.) We use the Amazon “grab and go” using your hand system. It’s not perfected yet, but within two years, it’s going to be phenomenal. Then we’ll be able to put the ticket in there and work a deal between Ticketmaster and Amazon. Just as technology has created the problem, so technology will solve the problem.
There’s also an outcry against fees.
They want to come in and say get rid of fees, but the reality is the fees are split by everybody in the pool. The artist gets some of the fees. Yes, they do. The building gets some of the fees and the promoter gets some of the fees. The fees are shared. There is an economic universe out there of rebates and waiving rent and giving artists free nights in the arena. That’s all part of this ecosystem of sharing fees. Everyone tends to forget about that. Ticketmaster does not even make the majority of fees. It’s not the fees. Should we tell people what the fees are in advance? That’s a good idea. But at the end of the day, if we want to attack what ultimately creates the majority of problems that people like The Cure or Taylor Swift feels strongly about, then attack the secondary companies who have no skin in the game.
“Shaq is our partner,” Leiweke says of NBA star Shaquille O’Neal, whose Big Chicken franchise is among the concessions found at OVG venues.
Joel Barhamand
Do you think Congress is focusing on the right players then?
Congress can’t even get a budget passed. Can they please just go run the country. Do I think they could solve the ticketing problem? No. These are the people saying it’s all Ticketmaster’s fault. No. Come learn the business, and what we’ll tell you is that the very same lobbyists you’re listening to that wrote that bill that you want to pass — they’re the problem.
The lion’s share of an act’s income comes from live shows. How much longer can we look at the live business as this sort of unlimited resource for artists, and whose responsibility is it to foster new arena and stadium acts?
How long can we maintain this ratio? I think forever because as I said music is the essence of our life. The economics have shifted, but the demand for music, recorded music, hasn’t shifted. It’s streaming now, and the economics are different. But we now have more ability to get more music from more artists than ever before. That’s who’s developing the emerging artists, god bless them — those streaming services. Ironically, they took some of the economics out of what an artist makes but they’ve created tens of thousands of more artists now, and who would have ever guessed that today we’d be seeing these K-pop and Latino artists? I’m looking at some of the numbers we did for Grupo Firme and Rauw Alejandro. The amount of tickets that Latino artists sell is unheard of. The same with K-pop. We just did four nights of K-pop including Suga, and UBS sold out everything. We had record merchandise sales. We’re going to continue to see that, and I give a lot of credit to the streaming industry. That’s going to be the live pipeline. So, maybe the economics ultimately got kind of turned a little bit against the artist, but it’s created far more artists that can now go sell out arenas.
Will they come up through the clubs or go straight to arenas?
We have the theater alliance because I think that’s highly important. Clubs are highly important. Both Live Nation and AEG are doing a great job on clubs. I’m a huge fan of Bowery Presents, and we’d like to have a better relationship with them. We will one day when the personalities get shifted. Will we keep going at the rate we’ve been going the last two years? Probably not. We’re seeing record rates, and we see it again next year. Our bookings are very, very strong for next year. But this is going to continue for a while because people have pent-up demand and discretionary income. I also think people went through Covid and said I’m going to go live life. Well, music happens to be something that relates to everybody. So, this isn’t going to stop. We’ll continue to develop smaller venues like Acrisure, which is a huge stepping stone for a lot of Latino bands. Everyone was scared of that marketplace except for Paul Tollett. I’m like, Paul’s pretty smart. I’ll follow his lead.
The same goes for sustainability when it comes to venues and festivals. You seem to be doing a lot on that front, but whose responsibility is it?
Sustainability is the overriding factor of this company. We spent $150 million on sustainability in Seattle saving the roof. I floated that roof in the air for three years. Everyone thought build a new arena, but that is the greatest waste of our planet — new steel, new glass, new everything. I thought, what if we reuse stuff? The arena’s roof is historic. It was originally part of the Washington State Pavilion at the 1962 World’s Fair. We figured out how to float it in the air with temporary steel supports, and I reused the steel. Then we took the front of the building and built an atrium system and a people-moving system to get everyone up and down. Take the existing arena, tear it down, build a hole three times as large, go down, not up because I use less energy below ground level. I don’t have to spend as much money on heating or cooling. Then drop the roof back on. Everyone says, “Oh, the renovation.” I’m like renovation? This is $1.15 billion. Renovate my ass. The only thing that stayed was the roof, and then three of the four sides is the original glass from the 1962 World’s Fair. I preserved it, packed it, stored it for two years and then put it back on. Then I had to retrofit the glass with fiber for earthquakes because the earthquake standard has changed since 1962.
You and Irving Azoff were once rivals and now you’re partners. What does that say about the music industry?
Yo-yos. It’s up and down, up ad down. We were partners, then enemies, then partners. I’m hoping that cycle has played itself out completely. Michael Rapino and I fought aggressively against each other. We’re not best of friends, but I’d say in our business he’s one of the greatest partners I have. The music business is a unique business because everyone thinks they’ve got to be either best of friends or fighting each other. There’s no in-between. The drama in the music business is crazy. We’re drama free around here. Our job is to get along with everybody. That’s the good thing about being private. People say, “Do you get along with Phil?” I wish him nothing but the best of luck. Whatever AEG does, I’m proud that I hired the majority of those people. And guess what, whether they succeed or fail, it will have little impact on my company. The greatest drama I had in my life is when Irving and I were fighting each other because he’s formidable. I’m very happy he’s on my side of the equation.
Following new K-pop festival launches in Los Angeles and Las Vegas in the past year, the New York area is next up to host a new live experience for the ever-expanding fandom. Explore See latest videos, charts and news See latest videos, charts and news Billboard can reveal the first details about the inaugural Krazy K-Pop Super Concert coming to […]
Swifties in attendance at Taylor Swift‘s second Chicago stop of the Eras Tour got a special surprise courtesy of country star Maren Morris. Towards the end of Swift’s show on Saturday (June 3), the singer stopped to address her audience and offer them a never-before-seen treat. “Tonight, I’m gonna play a song I’ve never played […]
Detroit’s beloved electronic music festival, Movement, returns to Hart Plaza tomorrow (May 27) for its 21st edition. While the fest’s 30,000 attendees partake in sets by Basement Jaxx, Skrillex, Kaskade, Kevin Saundreson, DJ Minx and many more, employees of Paxahau—the local independent rave promoter that’s produced Movement since 2006—will spend the weekend like they always do: taking notes on how to improve for next year.
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In 2000, the house and techno (with a little bit of hip-hop) fest became, along with Ultra and EDC, among the first few dance music festivals to launch in the U.S. It was the first to put its locally forged genre, techno, on a stage.
Yet unlike Ultra and EDC, which are now synonymous with EDM and all its glitzy commercial fanfare, Movement has remained rather minimalist in its approach—it’s really still all about the music, sans fireworks and mega-stages.
“This is a labor of love that all of us clustered around since we were young,” Paxahau Founder Jason Huvaere says of the company’s tight-knit team of OG ravers. “Detroit techno culture is what we committed to years ago, it’s second nature. The sustainable business part is another thing.”
But in an increasingly difficult landscape for independent event promoters, Paxahau is still turning a profit. The company is run by a team of 15 year-round, full-time employees across four departments: marketing and communications, production, talent, and creative. During Movement, they bring in an event staff of 350 to help bring the event to life.
Before taking over the festival as producer in 2006, Paxahau was first connected to Movement by throwing its afterparties. It stays true to that early ethos by now hosting its official afterparties, many in collaboration with labels, artists and other promoters. The company also hosts dance events at their partner venues throughout the year—Magic Stick, TV Lounge and Spot Lite, and for events over 1,500 people, at Detroit’s Masonic and Russell Industrial Center. Last year, they hosted 56 shows.
Movement 2022
Nick LeTellier
But like the other independent dance festivals across the country that survived the COVID shutdown (Southern California’s Lightning in a Bottle and CRSSD, Elements in Pennsylvania and Florida’s jam-band infused Hulaween among them), Movement has faced the existential threat of continually rising production costs – from cryo to porta-potty rentals.
“It was like a generation lost,” Huvaere says of people working in event production and other related jobs. He cites a 25 percent increase in production costs, a drastic uptick unheard of in prior years, and a continued rising of prices.
To offset this, Paxahau had to raise 2023 ticket prices but remain focused on fair rates, with three-day tier two GA passes going for $279 plus fees. (By comparison, Ultra’s 2024 tier two weekend GA price is set at $400 and Goldenvoice’s Portola 2023, a two-day fest, tier two GA passes are $360. Passes for the three-day Elements go for $289.)
A big reason Movement still exists at all is because the loyalty of its fanbase. Huvaere calls the third of Movement 2020 ticket-holders that held onto their passes (instead of requesting refunds) after the festival was cancelled during the pandemic as the main reason the festival survived. “I don’t know that I heard any other story in all of my conference calls, shared emails and comparing notes [with other festival organizers] that had that kind of a response,” he says.
A partnership with Twitch, who reached out to Paxahau early in the pandemic about doing exclusive livestreams on their platform, also provided a lifeline to both the company and the rich pool of Detroit artists that participated, including Detroit residents DJ Holographic, Eddie Fowlkes, Juan Atkins and many more. (Movement itself is not livestreamed, although select sets are recorded for later release.) 1.2 million unique viewers from the U.S., Canada, England, Germany, Russia and beyond tuned into the Paxahau Twitch channel during the lockdown to get their Detroit house and techno fix.
Surprisingly, livestreaming DJ sets is at the core of how Paxahau was born. Back in 1998, when the Detroit underground electronic scene was getting snuffed out by the police and the internet, Paxahau turned to the burgeoning world wide web to transmit techno. While it’s now easy to livestream a DJ set from anywhere with a decent internet connection, back in the dial-up days, Paxahau had to install an ISDN line, build a server rack and use Winamp software to create what was then called “a Shoutcast.”
Fans with their Shoutcast server address could type it into their Winamp and tune in, and Paxahau would celebrate when they had 12 simultaneous listeners. When a club called Motor started regularly booking dance music, Paxahau wired up the club and began livestreaming from there.
By 2000, they started producing parties again and in 2006 became the torchbearers for Movement when techno forefather Kevin Saunderson dropped out of hosting the sixth Movement festival after doing so the year prior. Paxahau was set to co-produce Saunderson’s stage at the fest, so they reached out to the City of Detroit and petitioned to run the event and keep it alive.
“The event at that time was a mess,” says Huavere. “It lost money six years in a row and had had three different producers. We wanted to do whatever we could to stabilize it, and the city wanted to do whatever they could to identify the stabilizing agent to it.”
While Paxahau got help that first year via “some great relationships that all came together to help us,” after that, they committed as Movement’s sole producers. “Fast forward a few years after that experience, we had a couple of rainstorms, wind storms, cancellations and mishaps – there’s all kinds of things that beat up festival promoters, and we definitely got beat up,” says Huavere. But “over time, through the natural process of evolution, the festival itself has come of age, and we’ve come of age.”
Detroit’s downtown has also changed drastically over the last 20-plus years, with its renaissance finally taking hold around 2008. Billions of dollars have gone into restoring once long-abandoned historical buildings in the area, with the city’s downtown now filled with hotels, bars and restaurants. Huvaere says the city has supported Movement from the beginning and that “techno culture is very celebrated by city residents and staffers.”
Movement 2022
Jacob Mulka
Movement’s ticket revenue is meant to match the cost of throwing the festival, with merch and beverage sales, along with the funds generated by partnerships, allowing them to turn a profit. Their annual festival budget is designed to match the audience size, typically 30,000 attendees each day, although this number can be impacted by the heavy rains common during spring in Michigan.
Corporate partners—many of whom Paxahau has worked with for years—are an important part of what keep the festival thriving. (“If we didn’t have sponsors, you’d notice,” Huavere says.) Larger partners like Red Bulls and JARS Cannabis underwrite the costs of building certain stages, while online music gear superstore Sweetwater hosts the Movement studio, a tent providing fans and DJs with hands-on learning about how electronic music is made.
For Paxahua, it’s essential that sponsoring brands are aligned with the vibe of the fests. The festival doesn’t actually even have a sales team, with all of these relationships established organically over the years, with a focus on long-term partnerships.
Above all, promoting Detroit dance music and supporting local artists is the most important thing Paxahau and Movement continue to do. “We have all been working together for almost 30 years. This is all one big organism, one big family,” Huavere asserts. Paxahau has hosted events with Craig and Saunderson – who Huavere says have long been “actively promoting their brand and Detroit all over the world” – since the company’s earliest days, and both techno legends often do stage takeovers at the fest.
Jason Huvaere
Courtesy of Movement
For Paxahau, supporting the next generation of Detroit talent is also an “absolute duty,” with rising stars DJ Holographic and Henry Brooks among the acts the team saw play in small local venues and knew just had it.
“Watching these artists develop over time and seeing them play in front of a larger and larger crowd and seeing the way that crowd reacts,” Huavere says, “that’s probably one of the best parts about this project, being part of and feeling that evolution.”
Part of the beauty of attending Movement as an out-of-town house and techno lover is experiencing the city, culture and people that made techno. Many of its founders and early innovators are still active on the scene, sharing their music and wisdom with the next generation of ravers and DJs. So too is Movement an excellent place to be reminded of, and educated on, dance music’s roots as a Black, queer urban American artform.
Bigger companies have expressed interest in acquiring Paxahau, but with Movement’s position as one of the few remaining indie dance festivals, Huavere is grateful to not have to adhere to a business structure that doesn’t align with the company’s values and vision.
“One of the great things about [Paxahau’s] culture is we aren’t goal-focused, but direction-focused,” he says. “It’s always been about the trajectory, the journey, the emotion. It’s never been about, ‘I need to get this thing done,’ or ‘I need to get this thing acquired.’ For the future, I just want to preserve that.”
Fans, rejoice: You’re going to get to see a lot more than just Megan Thee Stallion and Mariah Carey at this year’s L.A. Pride celebrations. On Thursday (May 18), Christopher Street West Association (the organization that produces L.A. Pride) shared with Billboard the full slate of performers set to take the stage at this year’s […]
EDC Las Vegas, one of the world’s biggest music festivals, is set to launch tomorrow (May 19) at the Las Vegas Motor Speedway. Ahead of the event, Insomniac Events CEO Pasquale Rotella has warned of myriad travel delays attendees may face while getting to the mega-fest.
In an Instagram post ahead of the event, Rotella wrote that “If you’re flying to Vegas, it’s important to know there is ongoing construction at Harry Reid International Airport/McCarran Airport that has resulted in regular flight delays. If you’re driving, know there is construction along the 15 freeway on the way to Vegas that is causing delays depending on the time of day.”
As reported by Fox5Vegas, current airport delays are due to high winds, along with one runway currently closed for scheduled maintenance. Meanwhile, a 10.7 mile stretch of Interstate 15 connecting the Las Vegas Strip to the Motor Speedway is under construction, as the Interstate is widened from four to six lanes, along with the addition of a new weigh station, enforcement improvements, truck parking and an interchange addition.
These improvements are happening ahead of Las Vegas hosting the 2024 Super Bowl at the city’s freshly built Allegiant Stadium, and the city hosting the Formula 1 Las Vegas Grand Prix this November.
“If you have the flexibility to adjust your travel plans, you may want to consider arriving earlier,” Rotella’s post continues. “These potential issues are likely to be exacerbated with so many ravers coming to town. I highly recommend keeping in touch with your airlines to stay up to date on any flight schedule changes or other important information.”
The Las Vegas Motor Speedway is located roughly 17 miles north of the Vegas Strip via I-15. The three-day festival annually hosts roughly 400,000 attendees and this year will feature more than 230 dance artists including Kaytranada, Alison Wonderland, Martin Garrix, Armin van Buuren and many (many) of the world’s leading dance/electronic acts.
Traffic to and from the event is typically heavy, with attendees arriving largely by car and shuttle, and many artists and high-rolling attendees opting to skip traffic by taking a helicopter from the Strip to the Speedway.
Check out Rotella’s full statement via Instagram below:
Fans who missed international superstar Harry Styles‘ epic Love on Tour North America run have two more chances to catch the “Music for a Sushi Restaurant” singer perform live.
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After completing three rescheduled shows at the Forum in Los Angeles Jan. 26, 27 and 29, Styles announced on Friday (Jan. 13) that he will play two final nights at Acrisure Arena, Southern California’s newest 11,000-capacity world-class venue in Greater Palm Springs, on Jan. 31 and Feb. 1. Madi Diaz will serve as a special guest for the two dates.
Since launching Sept. 4, 2021, Styles has netted $338.9 million and sold 2.6 million tickets for the Live Nation produced, 120 show tour according to Billboard Boxscore. Love on Tour made many stops around the globe including North America, Latin America, Australia, New Zealand and Asia.
Tickets for the Acrisure Arena tour are expected to sell fast and to ensure tickets get into the hands of fans, Love on Tour has partnered with Ticketmaster’s Verified Fan platform for two separate pre-sales. Fans can register for both pre-sales here through Jan. 16 at 12 p.m. pacific time.
Registered fans who receive a code will have access to purchase tickets before the general public starting on Jan. 19 at 10 a.m. pacific time. Only fans that have received a unique code will have the chance to purchase tickets for performances on a first come, first served basis. General on sale for tickets will begin Jan. 20 at 10 a.m. pacific time at hstyles.co.uk/tour.
See Styles’ concert announcement below.
Looks like Taylor Swift is getting ready for her The Eras Tour with a little stage time. Unsuspecting fans at The 1975‘s concert in London on Thursday (Jan. 12) were beyond surprised when Swift took the stage at the O2 arena to not only perform one of the rock band’s classic tracks, but also to live-debut her latest hit single.
In fan-captured video, Swift is seen emerging onstage in a sparkling silver dress, taking in the screaming crowd of fans. In other moments, the singer takes a shot covering The 1975’s “The City” — a fan-favorite track from the band’s self-titled first album — with the help of her trusty acoustic guitar.
“Yeah, counting cards was the best job he ever had/ Cleaning up/ He got good with his fours and his twos/ Community service was the best job he ever had/ Cleaning up/ He got sick on the floor and his shoes,” Swift sang, before launching into the track’s catchy pre-chorus.
But that wasn’t all Swift came prepared to sing. Shortly after, the mega-star surprised fans even further by giving “Anti-Hero” its first-ever live performance. Considering how big of a splash the track has made — its currently in seventh week atop the Billboard Hot 100, after all — the entire stadium hung onto every word Swift sang, joining her for the track’s catchy refrain: “It’s me, hi/ I’m the problem, it’s me.”
Swift won’t have to wait for long before dusting off her best acoustic guitars: She’s scheduled to head out on the road for The Eras Tour, which is scheduled to kick off March 17 in Glendale, Ariz.
Watch Swift perform during The 1975’s show in the videos below.
Clay Aiken and Ruben Studdard are taking their friendship — which began on American Idol season two — on the road. On Monday (Dec. 12), the duo announced that they will be teaming up in 2023 for a joint tour — Twenty The Tour — across the United States and Canada.
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“@clayaiken & I are hitting the road this Spring, twenty years after our debuts on American Idol. Join us for the first leg of Twenty | The Tour,” Studdard shared on Instagram, along with the official tour poster and dates for the first leg of the trek.
Twenty The tour will make stops in New York, Philadelphia, Chicago, Atlanta and more, beginning on April 12 in Troy, N.Y., and concluding on May 16 in Wausau, Wis. Tickets for the tour are available for purchase through the tour’s official website, rubenandclay.com.
The pair chatted about their joint tour in a Monday appearance on The View after a jubilant performance of Donny Hathaway’s “This Christmas.”
“We were here five years ago to announce our Broadway Christmas special, which was exciting for us. We’re getting old, Ruben, we are about to celebrate our 20th anniversary from the year we were on Idol, and so Ruben and I are are hitting the road together with a 20th anniversary tour all across the country through the year,” Aiken told The View‘s hosts. “We’re starting out this spring and we’re going to be celebrating the last 20 years since we did Idol and the music we’ve gotten to make and the friendships we made along the way.”
During the pair’s appearance on The View, they also revealed that they will be returning to American Idol in the upcoming season for the finale, as the finale date will coincide with their season two finale episode’s.
The second season of American Idol aired from January to May of 2003. Studdard faced off against Aiken in the finals, and ultimately won. Following the show, the pair remained close, which Aiken discussed in a Dec. 3 Instagram post.
“We don’t get to choose our family. Most family is predetermined by blood; some are predestined by God to come into our lives. I’ve got one brother who was born into my family and one brother who the good Lord introduced me to in 2003,” he wrote.
The “Invisible” singer continued, “A lot gets written and said about ‘how sweet it is’ that Rᴜʙᴇɴ and I have ‘kept in touch’ over the years. If you have the blessing of knowing Ruben Studdard, you understand: There aren’t many humans more selfless or gracious or loyal than he. America fell in love with him because his performances made them feel happy and welcomed; that’s who he is in real life too.”
See the full list of dates and Studdard’s announcement via Instagram below. Check out Aiken and Studdard’s appearance on The View in the video above.